Player Watch - Steven Bergwijn signs for Ajax

[Strikeb4ck]

I don't know how you could say Bergwijn was poor today and then not mention Son. Bergwijn had far more influence on the game with his defensive work and holdup play and offered about an equal threat as Son going forwards...

For what it's worth I think both of them played fine so I'm not criticizing one or the other, but it doesn't make sense to me to try and get after Stevie for his performance today if you're not going to say the same about Son.

Chilwell was pretty much nonexistant as an attacking threat whereas the two half chances on crosses that they had both came from James (Son's man), which speaks a bit to the point I'm making.

 

[dtxspurs]

Thought he played decently well.

 

[rossdapep]

He did play well. I don't know why people are laying in to him. He worked hard and actually nearly scored with some intelligent movement. He was always linking up and worked hard. Tense game so moments of brilliance are harder to come by.

 

[TheTanguy]

Nothing super spectacular, but he did what Mourinho asked him to do and had some good moments on the ball. He certainly wasn't poor.

6.5/10

 

[beats1]

I like him but he is trying too hard, sometimes he just needs to calm down and slip in Reguillon in

Chelsea gave none of our front 4 any space and the CM and CB's didn't move the ball fast enough to take advantage of that

 

[Duck]

He did what he was instructed to do which is why he was on the pitch for 89mins.

There's a long list of players in the world who obey instructions. It should take something more to play on the wing for a team contending for the title.

 

[Duck]

Chilwell was pretty much nonexistant as an attacking threat whereas the two half chances on crosses that they had both came from James (Son's man), which speaks a bit to the point I'm making.

Other way around. Son was playing on the right, Bergwijn was on the left. Bergwijn was the one defending James's flank.

 

[Kiedis]

I really like that this lad has seemingly usurped Lucas. So much to like about him, good physically, consisent touch, decent vision and far more intelligent in his choices than the brazilian. Offers a good balance to Kane and Son.

 

[Haddock]

When you're a winger you spend 90% of your time without the ball. Bergwijn's defensive discipline, work rate, and decision making are what puts him in the first eleven at the moment.

 

[Duck]

I really like that this lad has seemingly usurped Lucas. So much to like about him, good physically, consisent touch, decent vision and far more intelligent in his choices than the brazilian. Offers a good balance to Kane and Son.

"consisent" touch? But most of his touches were too heavy. It was a similar story vs Manchester City.
Far more intelligent in his choices? Because he plays more back passes and simple lay offs?

Bergwijn has had next to no impact in the final third the last two games he's played.

 

[Duck]

When you're a winger you spend 90% of your time without the ball. Bergwijn's defensive discipline, work rate, and decision making are what puts him in the first eleven at the moment.

So play Ben Davies instead. Same limitations offensively, but a superior defender.

 

[Haddock]

So play Ben Davies instead. Same limitations offensively, but a superior defender.

Yeah, right. I understand that you want to make a point. But in this particular case it's so stupid I can't take it seriously.

 

[Duck]

Yeah, right. I understand that you want to make a point. But in this particular case it's so stupid I can't take it seriously.

Not my problem you have no argument.
You keep whaling on about defensive contribution, completely failing to understand that's not a winger's main job. Bergwijn has contributed nothing in the final third the last two games, and if you're going to keep falling back on defense, then it simply makes more sense to play an actual defender.

 

[SamR]

I thought he played well. First half we saw little glimpses of his ability to turn and find a bit of space. Panicked a little when it mattered, but so did everyone yesterday.
Second half he impressed me with his defensive duties. Once Jose determined it was a point we wanted from the game, i thought he showed maturity and willingness to bust a gut. Solid 7/10

 

[Haddock]

Not my problem you have no argument.
You keep whaling on about defensive contribution, completely failing to understand that's not a winger's main job. Bergwijn has contributed nothing in the final third the last two games, and if you're going to keep falling back on defense, then it simply makes more sense to play an actual defender.

No, it doesn't make sense. I'd say we can all agree on the following:

1) Being solid defensively and effective upfront is our best chance of winning tough matches
2) All players contribute defensively and offensively

Bale and Lucas are probably more effective upfront but less so defensively. Davies isn't a winger and out of the bunch, he's the worst upfront. Therefore you can make a valid argument that Bergwijn who's a solid defender (as you yourself agree on), and a solid attacker (
0.34 Goals and 0.67 assists per 90 minutes in his career), should get the nod ahead of the others, in this particular match.

The fact that Bergwijn hasn't scored or assisted in his past 2 matches is no indication of his contribution as a player overall (See premise 1 and 2), especially considering there are other factors as chances created, etc.

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

When you're a winger you spend 90% of your time without the ball. Bergwijn's defensive discipline, work rate, and decision making are what puts him in the first eleven at the moment.

That doesn't make any sense to me, because if you want a winger for his defensive attributes and work rate there are other players in the squad who can do that job better without having to move Son to the right. It's entirely puzzling to me why Bergwijn is starting in the league.

Not my problem you have no argument.
You keep whaling on about defensive contribution, completely failing to understand that's not a winger's main job. Bergwijn has contributed nothing in the final third the last two games, and if you're going to keep falling back on defense, then it simply makes more sense to play an actual defender.

That's not really entirely true. Haddock does have a valid point. Think for instance about Lamela as the "defensive winger" earlier. Personally I just don't think Bergwijn is the best in the squad for that task, but the role very much exists.

 

[Duck]

No, it doesn't make sense. I'd say we can all agree on the following:

1) Being solid defensively and effective upfront is our best chance of winning tough matches
2) All players contribute defensively and offensively

Bale and Lucas are probably more effective upfront but less so defensively. Davies isn't a winger and out of the bunch, he's the worst upfront. Therefore you can make a valid argument that Bergwijn who's a solid defender (as you yourself agree on), and a solid attacker (
0.34 Goals and 0.67 assists per 90 minutes in his career), should get the nod ahead of the others, in this particular match.

The fact that Bergwijn hasn't scored or assisted in his past 2 matches is no indication of his contribution as a player overall (See premise 1 and 2), especially considering there are other factors as chances created, etc.

Career? I'm more interested in recent form.
Bergwijn has 0 goals and 0 assists in 6 Premier League appearances this year, totaling to 314 minutes. Putting stats aside and judging him on what I actually see, he does not strike me as a particularly damaging player. Most of the complements he seems to be getting here are for glimpses and nice touches, because that's mostly all he's really shown, glimpses and touches. He doesn't look even half as threatening as any of Liverpool's front three of Mane, Jota and Salah, and the stats further reflect that.
If anyone wants to pull the boring old line that comparing Bergwijn to those guys isn't fair, consider this: Do you think we're contending for trophies this year? I'd like to think we are, and if so, I think it's perfectly reasonable to expect more in the final third than what Bergwijn has produced this season.

Working hard defensively is not enough, simple as that.

 

[Shadydan]

The fact that people are complaining about players playing in the current best team in the league absolutely blows my mind...oh not it doesn't actually this is SC after all

 

[Duck]

That doesn't make any sense to me, because if you want a winger for his defensive attributes and work rate there are other players in the squad who can do that job better without having to move Son to the right. It's entirely puzzling to me why Bergwijn is starting in the league.


That's not really entirely true. Haddock does have a valid point. Think for instance about Lamela as the "defensive winger" earlier. Personally I just don't think Bergwijn is the best in the squad for that task, but the role very much exists.

The thing with Lamela is that he's proven himself a very strong attacking threat, even without goals or assists (which he's very unlucky not to have this year).
Purely defensive wingers exist, but they're mostly in lesser teams, not teams competing for Premier Leagues. Even the more defensive-minded wingers in past top teams like Antonio Valencia and Park Ji Sung provided more offensively than glimpses and touches.

The fact that people are complaining about players playing in the current best team in the league absolutely blows my mind...oh not it doesn't actually this is SC after all

Right, because we're on top of the table, we should all just mindlessly conform to the same view and not have any opinions on what could be improved...

 

[Japhet]

Not my problem you have no argument.
You keep whaling on about defensive contribution, completely failing to understand that's not a winger's main job. Bergwijn has contributed nothing in the final third the last two games, and if you're going to keep falling back on defense, then it simply makes more sense to play an actual defender.

He's a Haddock, not a whale.