- Feb 1, 2005
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- #481
He is, I misunderstood your post, turns out i'm senile
Racist abuse in our stands, we need to face it if it’s there.
- Thread starter Donki
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I've heard a number of comments through the years that you could construe as racist. Although quite possibly it may not have been. Its all down to context and meaning, which is sometimes hard to gauge.
I remember the people charged with the Sol chants /songs which initially were deemed racist but were overturned on appeal as it was then decided they weren't (iirc). You could argue that they were more homophobic than anything but thats a separate issue altogether.
Only the person who created the song will know quite what the meaning was. It gets complicated with chants because you may have someone intending to highlight a racial undercurrent but you may equally have a number of people just following tribal instincts to unsettle the person without any intent (the Adebeyor chant is a case in point). Thats the problem with football, there's an inherent simmering of hate or dislike, where you will say some quite nasty stuff or follow what others are doing, which you ordinarily wouldn't say or do, just to get at the other team. It does lend itself to some rather unsavoury stuff. And most of us are to blame to a degree.
As I said previously I heard someone call Willian an animal on sun as he went to take a corner. Not sure what the meaning there was but felt very out of the ordinary.
I also remember someone shout at Adebeyor to go back to his slum when he was playing for us. I'm not sure if either of those things are racist per se but its certainly borderline in my opinion and highlights the possibility that we're not perfect.
Perhaps this is a watershed moment where those borderline comments and chants will stop or become much less frequent. Although when emotions run high you can never completely rule out the possibility.
As for the rudiger stuff then we will just have to wait and see. Id be shocked if it was something as obvious as what has been stated. However if it was proven then it would be a very dark day for the club and all of us, especially considering our history, our fan base and the demographics of the area where we are located. That would cause a lot of damage to the club and id be totally ashamed and appalled to be associated with it.
I remember the people charged with the Sol chants /songs which initially were deemed racist but were overturned on appeal as it was then decided they weren't (iirc). You could argue that they were more homophobic than anything but thats a separate issue altogether.
Only the person who created the song will know quite what the meaning was. It gets complicated with chants because you may have someone intending to highlight a racial undercurrent but you may equally have a number of people just following tribal instincts to unsettle the person without any intent (the Adebeyor chant is a case in point). Thats the problem with football, there's an inherent simmering of hate or dislike, where you will say some quite nasty stuff or follow what others are doing, which you ordinarily wouldn't say or do, just to get at the other team. It does lend itself to some rather unsavoury stuff. And most of us are to blame to a degree.
As I said previously I heard someone call Willian an animal on sun as he went to take a corner. Not sure what the meaning there was but felt very out of the ordinary.
I also remember someone shout at Adebeyor to go back to his slum when he was playing for us. I'm not sure if either of those things are racist per se but its certainly borderline in my opinion and highlights the possibility that we're not perfect.
Perhaps this is a watershed moment where those borderline comments and chants will stop or become much less frequent. Although when emotions run high you can never completely rule out the possibility.
As for the rudiger stuff then we will just have to wait and see. Id be shocked if it was something as obvious as what has been stated. However if it was proven then it would be a very dark day for the club and all of us, especially considering our history, our fan base and the demographics of the area where we are located. That would cause a lot of damage to the club and id be totally ashamed and appalled to be associated with it.
Ok let's broaden things give me any racist comments or hate speech from TR or the DFLA.
Shadydan
Well-Known Member
- Jul 7, 2012
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No let's not because this discussion it's irrelevant and provactive.
punkisback
Well-Known Member
- Apr 10, 2004
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They support a literal racist and islamophobe in Tommy Robinson. They're clever about what they do and keep it all dog whistle; surely you're not that unintelligent that you can't understand their coded message. Either that or you support them, which is disgusting. If you look at the balance of evidence, i'd hazard to say they are more racist than non racist. If you are a member of a racist organisation, get out of my club please.
And still a lot of talking but no evidence
and it's not your club by the way !punkisback
Well-Known Member
- Apr 10, 2004
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And still a lot of talking but no evidence
Football must send a clear message to far-right groups
The Democratic Football Lads Alliance has become a vehicle to spread Islamophobic hate in the name of football and should not be welcome in our game, writes Sam Cunningham.
inews.co.uk
Shortly afterwards, Meighan resigned from the group, citing questions around where money paid to the “non-profit” organisation was being spent. But the DFLA is still going, now led by Phillip Hickin. The Anti-Fascist Network uncovered evidence that the DFLA had linked up with a group of Polish Nazi hooligans.
Members of the Polish group openly show off swastika tattoos and have posed in Nazi salutes in front of Nazi flags. As the web darkens and tangles, it has emerged Robinson has recruited members of the group as personal security.
They have another march coming up soon in London, the date of which won’t be publicised in this column. Last year, it was reported that a secret Facebook group for the organisation was full of violent, racist and misogynistic posts. Currently, there is an open page on the social media website representing the DFLA, which just last week posted that “paedophilia is one of the most horrendous crimes but there is something that leaves us with an even more sickening turn in our stomach and that is when the perpetrators are women”, without giving any explanation as to why gender makes any difference.
The page is full of remarkably extreme comments for a group claiming to be precisely against any forms of extremism. Over the weekend, they published a post outraged at Sky News linking them to the Christchurch terror attack, which prompted hundreds of equally outraged messages. Yet Darren Osborne, who in 2017 drove a van into pedestrians outside the Muslim Welfare House, less than 100 metres from the Finsbury Park Mosque, is listed in Brenton Tarrant’s manifesto as inspiration for the Christchurch attack, and Osborne has been referred to as a “scapegoat” by FLA members.
The club statement said that racists are not welcome at spurs, not my words but the board's and i think you'll find they make the rules; I'm merely repeating what they said. Independent of the matter racists are not welcome at Spurs and we don't want them here, surely you can agree to that, yes or no? But congrats for trying to defend a far right organisation. Why are you so keen to defend them?
Caco
Village Idiot
- Nov 2, 2004
- 1,586
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So our investigation into racial abuse is inconclusive according to the BBC.
Have to say that racism has no place in any environment, but I am a little bit sceptical about this one, Rudiger is the only one to have heard it, his captain then claims he was told they were singing a racist song, just sounds a bit iffy.
That said, I have heard things said in the lane which have no place, a game against Sunderland a good few years back, not sure who it was but one of the Irish Sunderland players fouled a Spurs player and the lad behind me started off calling him a paddy c***, despite us having Keane and Reid on the pitch, anyway turned around and told him in my flat Dublin accent to shut his mouth or I'd shut it for him, and he promptly apologized, in hindsight it could have went another way, but it is annoying and I'd be fairly certain that these type of nationalist comments are common place in every football ground, I'd go as far to say that Irish league grounds are a lot worse.
Have to say that racism has no place in any environment, but I am a little bit sceptical about this one, Rudiger is the only one to have heard it, his captain then claims he was told they were singing a racist song, just sounds a bit iffy.
That said, I have heard things said in the lane which have no place, a game against Sunderland a good few years back, not sure who it was but one of the Irish Sunderland players fouled a Spurs player and the lad behind me started off calling him a paddy c***, despite us having Keane and Reid on the pitch, anyway turned around and told him in my flat Dublin accent to shut his mouth or I'd shut it for him, and he promptly apologized, in hindsight it could have went another way, but it is annoying and I'd be fairly certain that these type of nationalist comments are common place in every football ground, I'd go as far to say that Irish league grounds are a lot worse.
I don't want to entertain you but last time i checked the word Paki was racist.
Tommy Robinson boasts about drugs and proclaims himself 'king of the whole Islam race', in leaked video
Bizarre footage shows EDL founder using racial slur and saying he had to call to 'Benjamin Netanf***ing blah'
www.independent.co.uk
Please can we stop going down this road.
punkisback
Well-Known Member
- Apr 10, 2004
- 4,428
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Agree Its gone too far down another road; people they have a licence to do things like this. Hopefully people can follow the mod's instructions and know how to maneuver correctly. Lets hope we can pass the test.
And still a lot of talking but no evidence
Here, straight from the horse's mouth:
Anyone trying to excuse or normalise the language and behaviour of bigots like Yaxley-Lennon are part of the problem.
Gassin's finest
C'est diabolique
- May 12, 2010
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There are dedicated threads to all this left-wing/right-wing internet wankery, can this stuff go in one of them?
CowInAComa
Well-Known Member
- Aug 31, 2012
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Why are you on our forum promoting Tommy Robinson and a far right football hooligan group?
It's all you've been doing for 2 days. Go and recruit for the dfla somewhere else.
Generally I agree. Except it's not simply "left wing/right wing internet wankery" it has a direct bearing on the topic we are discussing. You can't separate what happens in football stadiums from what is happening in the country as a whole. We have a poster among us who claims not to believe the EDL/DFLA are racist whilst at the same time we have posters in this thread reacting with incredulity at that the possibility that Tottenham fans may have directed racist abuse towards a black player.
Gassin's finest
C'est diabolique
- May 12, 2010
- 37,634
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Yeah but I don't want another otherwise progressive thread being mired in further tedious Brexit shite. That can go in the Brexit/Racism threads in D&D.
chrissivad
Staff
- May 20, 2005
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- #497
Gb160
Well done boys. Good process
- Jun 20, 2012
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Block 251 same as you.
Fair enough. But some things can't be fully discussed without looking at the wider context. Just in the last few days we've had the media storm over Stormzy's comments and now this. We've also had Gary Neville's comments and Sky's backtracking. We've got a Spurs fan in here defending the founder of the EDL and numerous other posters casting doubt on Rudiger's claims even before the findings of the independent inquiry have been released. None of us know what those findings will reveal - maybe it will turn out Rudiger misheard the chants- but to deny we have a problem with racism in this country would be massively naive.
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