New Stadium Details And Discussions

[Saoirse]

We had all better hope Cameron gets reelected next May

He has said he will abolish the HRA, which would be the next Archway appeals step

Plus if we exit EU in 2017 then Archway are fucked there too

The first part is possible, but it's reliant on a politician keeping his promise - a promise which in this case looks like vote fodder rather than anything realistic. In any case, it'd likely be replaced nearer the end of next Parliament i.e. 2019ish.

The second part is just false. You're confusing the European Convention on Human Rights with the European Union. Even if we were to leave the EU we would still be part of the Council of Europe (not to be confused with the European Council) which is the organisation behind the ECHR and thus subject to the rulings of the European Court of Human Rights, along with many other non-EU member states including the likes of Russia.

 

[Lilbaz]

I appreciate we dont know all the ins and outs of Archway's stance, but on the face of it at least, this case is another shining example of how utterly shambolic our planning policy is in this country. Even setting aside our allegiance to Spurs, how can one, reletively small, company hold up the redevelopment and regeneration of one of the most deprived areas of London for so long? Yes they have a business and yes they should be compensated for their losses and moved to new accomodation but no way should they be allowed have such a controlling say in the development.

I would be surprised (if we are genuine about our intention to build the stadium) if we havent made Archway a very fair offer for their premises and we have probably offered them accomodation elsewhere as well. Assuming thats the case, the courts will take a pretty dim view on Archway's stance as they have not taken steps to minimise their losses (which is a requirement of any party being CPO'd) and, as a result, will have a diminishing effect on their end compensation.

Same happened at the Emirates. The companies that held out for the big windfall lost out big time.

 

[DiscoD1882]

what we need is some pitch forks and a good old angry mob*






* i am not in away way legally or illegally advocating angry mobs or pitchforks.

 

[Lilbaz]

what we need is some pitch forks and a good old angry mob*






* i am not in away way legally or illegally advocating angry mobs or pitchforks.

I could only find a normal fork, will that do?

 

[we_all_loved_freund]

I

I think the issue might be that Archway are saying the CPO isn't valid in the first place, so I assume that has knock-on effects for all the other land.

Although again I'm not really sure what their grounds for appeal are.

I thought that a CPO was only needed in respect of their land? The rest of the land was acquired by private agreement.

As an aside, I don't see what issues it would raise in respect of the other land owners if we eventually paid over the odds for Archway; I couldn't see any form of redress that they might have?

 

[lillywhites61]

its really quite gutting isnt it, how ridiculous are the laws in this country that something as big and important for an entire area can be held up for so long like this! I love WHL and have loved going there for the the past 28 years but everyone can see it is time for progression to help both the club and the area. i feel genuinely sorry for the other business's in the area that are now going to be put at risk due to the greedyness of this one firm. I am sure this is purely down to greed as well.

 

[sherbornespurs]

As a reminder, the link below (document dated March 2014) forms the basis of Archway's original appeal to the CPO.

The main thrust appears to be their opinion that removing/relocating businesses etc in the vicinity of THFC is purely to satisfy the greed of THFC while not contributing to the overall regeneration of the High Road.

http://www.haringey.gov.uk/paul_winter___co-2.pdf

 

[davidmatzdorf]

But surely every year that passes we are losing millions!!!!!!

It will be 10 years at the earliest after the initial plans were put forwards.

That is just not right?!

It just isn't the way these negotiations are done. No one, just absolutely no one, simply throws money at obstructive landowners if there is a possibility of getting rid of them through compulsion at a lower cost. It would be a short-cut to unprofitability for any developer. Any developer, upon finding that the local authority is prepared to assist them with a CPO, would jump at the opportunity as the most cost-effective option.

10 years from inception to completion isn't even that unusual. Doing any development in London is an interminable process. I have a client, quite a ruthless private developer, who has been trying to develop one site in Barnet for 10 years and he still hasn't managed to build anything, because of a succession of issues with CPOs, valuation disputes, the local authority parachuting a regeneration scheme onto the neighbourhood and thus changing all the local planning policies, three rejected planning applications, a road widening that was proposed, confirmed and then cancelled...

Get it? This is how it is. You don't have to 'make mistakes' or 'be unlucky' for it to be like this - it just is, because the system is broken. What you do have to be is dogged and tenacious - you just keep going, solving one problem at a time until you can get your building built.

Re: Arsenal. 4 years it took them from plans to a spade in the grounds.

Rubbish. You must have missed their 2 years of fruitless jockeying with the local authority and their protracted, nightmarish land acquisition. I live 500m from the Emirates. I watched it all go down. Arsenal didn't submit a planning application until they had spent years battling perhaps 20 Archway-type landowners. Our land-acquisition, thanks to the skills of the late, unlamented, but very effective Paul Kemsley, was smooth, under-the-radar and remarkably low in cost, compared to Arsenal, who had to deal with Islington land values, as well as a multitude of hostile established businesses.

EDIT: I initially misread your post as '4 years from plans to completion', but your time-scale is still shorter than what really happened, even from plans to start of works.

 

[TheSpillage]

Reading the headline 'Spurs to face season away from home' on the BBC I thought there was some momentous news on stadium. But as I understand it, we all knew we'd be spending time in a temporary stadium didn't we? Is the news here that this high court appeal might just drag things on a little longer? I'm slightly confused...

 

[Roynie]

I've been lurking for many years. This is a great website with many intelligent participants, and some not so. After the news this morning i felt it was time to announce myself. Despite being a well educated 34 year old man with three children and a relatively serious job (which i should currently be performing rather than writing on this forum) i find myself sucked in every transfer window by the ITK section on this website. I have swayed wildly from pro Levy to Anti Levy and believing there really are people that are ITK to thinking they are 13 year old boys who are bored of playing Championship Manager. However after the recent transfer window and the continued delays to the new ground i have finally reached a position on both matters;

a) The ground will not be built for a very long time and probably not whilst ENIC are in charge. This does not make me anti ENIC though. I think it is too big a financial risk as i question whether we really have the fans to fill it. Do we really have a genuine waiting list of 30,000 people? Have you been to a thursday night Europa league match?

b) There genuinely are no ITK people on this board. Fazio, Dier, Yedlin were all named on BBC sport i believe this year before their names appeared on here. This does not make me anti ITK. I love it in fact, even if it is pure fantasy, and i'd miss it if it were gone (as i did earlier this summer when i tried to go cold turkey for a week).

I may just be in a negative mood because of the recent 'off pitch' progress (player acquisition and ground) of the club but you've got to admit it's all been a little underwhelming recently.

Interesting, because your member profile shows you as joining today!

 

[Roynie]

@davidmatzdorf: I seem to recall someone saying, it may have been you as you are well versed on these things, that even though they appeal the clock is still ticking. Could you tell me (us) at what point do they have to vacate the site, given that they are now appealing.

Additionally, do you know if an appeal could be heard earlier due to the considerble public interest and the delay it could cause to the regeneration of the area?

Ta muchly.

 

[Bobbins]

At least with this delay we will have more time to design something better than the Emirates with blue seats!

Trying to see the positives here.

Yeah, yeah of course you are, because that's what you do isn't it?

Every time there's some bad news about Spurs, I always comfort myself by popping on to SC thinking "Don't feel down, I'm sure Jimbo78 will have posted some positive stuff, he always looks on the bright side"...

 

[ardiles&villa]

I think enic although want to eventually get round to build a new stadium, are more than happy to buy time....

 

[fridgemagnet]

This shit's chess, it ain't checkers!

This "game" is playing out one or two moves ahead of what we get to hear.

Levy is a lot of things but stupid isn't one of them, if we've genuinely been surprised that they've gone this close to the deadline before appealing then i'm Sylvie van der Vaart and i'll be playing strip poker on Skype from 10pm tonight and i'm terrible at bluffing.

 

[0-Tibsy-0]

I could only find a normal fork, will that do?

I've only got a spoon. But I can wave it menacingly, which must count for something.

 

[Ledleys Knee]

Two words: Roman Abramovich

Clearly the puppet master behind Archway

 

[spursfan77]

As a reminder, the link below (document dated March 2014) forms the basis of Archway's original appeal to the CPO.

The main thrust appears to be their opinion that removing/relocating businesses etc in the vicinity of THFC is purely to satisfy the greed of THFC while not contributing to the overall regeneration of the High Road.

http://www.haringey.gov.uk/paul_winter___co-2.pdf

But that argument doesn't even make sense. Redevelopment is needed for regeneration anywhere regeneration in wanted. For the very thing to occur buildings have to be demolished and replaced or kept and renovated. The new stadium is the thrust behind it. Without that as the catalyst they'd be no regeneration.

Edit: forgot to say thanks for posting that. I hadn't seen it before.

 

[THFCSPURS19]

People blaming ENIC for this. The same ENIC who made the plans in the first place. LOL.

It's utterly brilliant logic, isn't it? Some people on here getting angry at ENIC for this. They are the ones who are building the new stadium for us, you idiots. How can you get angry at ENIC for something that's not their fault?

So fucking ungrateful.

We're all sad but Levy must be so fucking pissed off- he's worked on this for 6 YEARS and faced tonnes of complications.

The club is trying as hard as it can.

Blame the ****s at Archway, not the owners trying to develop the club FFS.

Fucking hell.

 

[Mister Jez]

Two words: Roman Abramovich

Clearly the puppet master behind Archway

Absolute bullshit, where is there a single shred of evidence to support your wild accusation? Where on earth do you get this conspiracy theory from?

 

[Annabel]

Archway Steel have appealed because:

• They're gooners.
• They're funded by evil villain Abramovitch.
• They're secretly funded by ENIC because ENIC don't really want to build the new stadium.
• The site sits atop the portal to the underworld and Hades can't be disturbed or it will be the end of days.
• They think they can get more money.

Decisions decisions...