The ousting of Daniel (COYS)

[cliff jones]

Daniel is paid 3m plus per year. The extra 3m was a bonus as you no doubt know. Never let the truth get in the way of a good story. Poch’s ambitions?……Daniel spent 110m on 3 players after CL. Final. Poch’s picks and we’ve got nothing from any of them. Poch is a decent coach but cannot pick players. Vast majority of our best team were here when he arrived.

you are right of course about the salary/bonus. Do we know what performance goals he hit to double his money? And thereby double that of his peers?

Buck stops with Levy, especially at that money, surely- whether on the quality of the due d done on Tanguy, as club record signing and a massive risk for a club 1bn in debt? Or on the job offer to that head-butting bigot, Gattuso? I could go on but I won’t.

This thread will flare up again if/when that lot lift the title, and I’ll wager as we reach kick off and deadline day in the summer. And when the squad is exposed in the cups in particular again next season.

My dislike for him will never stop me dropping 200 on a couple of tickets for a home game whenever I’m home, but I really wish he’d give someone else a go.

I’d love someone like Barber.

 

[newbie]

there is a very high chance City gave him a huge off shore wad of cash.

he will need it to fund his million kids,

in 15-20 years there will be a lot of rapid young people running around, its hard not to like Walker.

 

[superted4]

there is a very high chance City gave him a huge off shore wad of cash.

he will need it to fund his million kids,

in 15-20 years there will be a lot of rapid young people running around, its hard not to like Walker.

He’s a pillock whose little brain is kept in his cock. Pretty much sums up an unfortunate amount of young men who just shag about with kids everywhere. In this case he’s got the money to upkeep them.

 

[DogsOfWar]

you are right of course about the salary/bonus. Do we know what performance goals he hit to double his money? And thereby double that of his peers?

Buck stops with Levy, especially at that money, surely- whether on the quality of the due d done on Tanguy, as club record signing and a massive risk for a club 1bn in debt? Or on the job offer to that head-butting bigot, Gattuso? I could go on but I won’t.

This thread will flare up again if/when that lot lift the title, and I’ll wager as we reach kick off and deadline day in the summer. And when the squad is exposed in the cups in particular again next season.

My dislike for him will never stop me dropping 200 on a couple of tickets for a home game whenever I’m home, but I really wish he’d give someone else a go.

I’d love someone like Barber.

His bonus will be primarily based on business growth, so a certain increase in turnover and profit as well as the ratio of opex increase to profit increase the same as any other big business.
Our turnover went up from £444 million to £549.6 million, operating profit from £112.3 to £138.7 million, and whilst operating expense went up 21% operating profit increased around 24%. Our final losses are basically made up as they primarily consist up of just writing off £72 million of the value of the stadium.
These kind of results would trigger his maximum bonus.

Bonuses based on performance on the pitch would be for the football staff.
Just as bonuses for building products would be for production staff at a manufacturing company.

 

[alfie103]

You don't think the two are interconnected? If the business side runs well, that means there'll be more money to spend?

It does but it seems like we aren't ever going to go out and spend the sums necessary (including wages) on players which would get us to compete for the title and the CL. A number of posters have said as such in their posts so it seems a fairly widespread view on here at least. Our current wage bill puts us at 6th in the league and we don't really spend a lot of money on one player (we tend to buy a lot of players from low to medium level PL spending).

To me, we want to act like a big club and say 'we want to compete for the highest honours' when it doesn't cost us anything but as soon as it does, we hear 'we have to be careful with PSR' and 'we can't take risks by spending that much on a player'. If this is the case, why did we build a new stadium and put the club £1 billion in debt when we don't have the appetite to spend the money the stadium would apparently allow us to spend?

Now I don't necessarily mind that if the club said we can't compete with City and all that and we then target winning domestic trophies and the EL and ECL but I don't think we target those either. Tim Sherwood (as much as people may not like him) worked with Levy quite closely for a number of years and when asked, clearly stated Levy prefers top 4 over a trophy.

As much as I dislike Levy, he is a fantastic businessman and is a very clever man so this doesn't make sense to me unless he just wants Spurs to finish between 4th-7th every year as this is the sweet spot in getting the most revenue whilst spending the least amount of money to do it. For me, his main concern is setting the club up to be the most attractive (and therefore profitable) asset for ENIC as it can be.

 

[alfie103]

His bonus will be primarily based on business growth, so a certain increase in turnover and profit as well as the ratio of opex increase to profit increase the same as any other big business.
Our turnover went up from £444 million to £549.6 million, operating profit from £112.3 to £138.7 million, and whilst operating expense went up 21% operating profit increased around 24%. Our final losses are basically made up as they primarily consist up of just writing off £72 million of the value of the stadium.
These kind of results would trigger his maximum bonus.

Bonuses based on performance on the pitch would be for the football staff.
Just as bonuses for building products would be for production staff at a manufacturing company.

Doesn't this sum up the problem?

 

[ardiles&villa]

It does but it seems like we aren't ever going to go out and spend the sums necessary (including wages) on players which would get us to compete for the title and the CL. A number of posters have said as such in their posts so it seems a fairly widespread view on here at least. Our current wage bill puts us at 6th in the league and we don't really spend a lot of money on one player (we tend to buy a lot of players from low to medium level PL spending).

To me, we want to act like a big club and say 'we want to compete for the highest honours' when it doesn't cost us anything but as soon as it does, we hear 'we have to be careful with PSR' and 'we can't take risks by spending that much on a player'. If this is the case, why did we build a new stadium and put the club £1 billion in debt when we don't have the appetite to spend the money the stadium would apparently allow us to spend?

Now I don't necessarily mind that if the club said we can't compete with City and all that and we then target winning domestic trophies and the EL and ECL but I don't think we target those either. Tim Sherwood (as much as people may not like him) worked with Levy quite closely for a number of years and when asked, clearly stated Levy prefers top 4 over a trophy.

As much as I dislike Levy, he is a fantastic businessman and is a very clever man so this doesn't make sense to me unless he just wants Spurs to finish between 4th-7th every year as this is the sweet spot in getting the most revenue whilst spending the least amount of money to do it. For me, his main concern is setting the club up to be the most attractive (and therefore profitable) asset for ENIC as it can be.

This is exactly where I am at with levy. Great for what he’s done off the field, offers us a decent position in the league and ambition until that point but never gonna help us kick on to be the team we want as fans.

the man has to go but he never will.

 

[DogsOfWar]

Doesn't this sum up the problem?

Not really as this is his job.

Conversely, he won't get much of a bonus this year as we didn't have CL football so turnover etc will drop.

So success on the pitch (at least CL participation) does have an effect on his bonus as well.

 

[alfie103]

Not really as this is his job.

Conversely, he won't get much of a bonus this year as we didn't have CL football so turnover etc will drop.

So success on the pitch (at least CL participation) does have an effect on his bonus as well.

I think it does as it shows the main focus of his role will be the financial success of the club rather than the football success.

 

[allatsea]

I think it does as it shows the main focus of his role will be the financial success of the club rather than the football success.

Would you prefer football success and financial problems as per many PL clubs at the moment ? It seems unless the club is doped with outside funds and books are cooked no club can repeat the successes of Chelsea and Man City.

 

[alfie103]

Would you prefer football success and financial problems as per many PL clubs at the moment ? It seems unless the club is doped with outside funds and books are cooked no club can repeat the successes of Chelsea and Man City.

Why can't we repeat the success Arsenal and Liverpool have had? and yes I would prefer football success compared to passing PSR checks.

 

[Trent Crimm]

Not really as this is his job.

Conversely, he won't get much of a bonus this year as we didn't have CL football so turnover etc will drop.

So success on the pitch (at least CL participation) does have an effect on his bonus as well.

Levy will give himself a bonus for whatever he feels like. Always has always will.

 

[JUSTINSIGNAL]

Why can't we repeat the success Arsenal and Liverpool have had?

That's what we are trying to do from what I can see? We needed to increase our revenue streams to a similar level as theirs first though, and that is where the stadium has come in. Since then we have clearly been putting in a structure (new recruitment team, revamp of the youth setup etc, Scott Munn etc...) behind the scenes to help us achieve sustained success. We've only been in this post covid, new setup, additional revenue stream world for about 2-3 seasons so let's just see how we go before writing it all off.

 

[McFlash]

Why can't we repeat the success Arsenal and Liverpool have had? and yes I would prefer football success compared to passing PSR checks.

You seem to think it's easy to just go out, spend big and win things but for every Arsenal and Liverpool, there's a Chelsea and Everton.
PSR is still quite new and seemingly only going to get tighter, hopefully levelling the playing field and enabling Levy's long term vision to come to fruition because like it or not, he has a long term vision for the club and while we fans want instant success, it's not possible unless we're crooked.

Hopefully, we've seen the last of clubs buying their way to success in the way that Man City have and Chelsea before them.
Newcastle are an example of this, one of the richest clubs in the world but unable to spend vast amounts of money because the new rules are restricting them.

Our spending has increased since the stadium has been up and running and we're now in a very strong position to take advantage of the financial plight many clubs have found themselves in.

So yes, it's been a long and frustrating journey but with any luck, our patience is about to pay off.

I can't subscribe to this idea that Levy doesn't want to win things and is happy being fourth every season because success only builds his brand more.

 

[Neon_Knight_]

Perhaps we should bring back Irving Scholar , he's only 77 . We won the FA cup under him, surely the perfect fit with some of the other dodgy owners at other clubs these days and he nearly got Fergie, think of all the silverware we have lost out on.

Ex-Spurs chief says Man United legend Alex Ferguson went back on his word

ALEX FERGUSON shook hands on a “concrete” agreement to become Tottenham boss two years before he took over at Old Trafford. But the Scot left Spurs and chairman Irving Scholar in the lu…

www.thesun.co.uk

If you want us to be run by an owner who "nearly" does things that with hindsight would probably have won us trophies, Levy is surely in prime position. He "nearly" bought Suarez, Aguero, Hazard, Oscar, Willian, Mane and a whole host of other very good players who went on to win a bunch of trophies elsewhere. We "nearly" won the CL and several additional domestic cups, but lost in the finals. We "nearly" challenged for PL titles under Harry & Poch. We nearly broke into the "big 4" under Jol, but for 'Lasagne Gate'

Unfortunately, "nearly" doing things has been our biggest problem throughout the modern era.

 

[alfie103]

You seem to think it's easy to just go out, spend big and win things but for every Arsenal and Liverpool, there's a Chelsea and Everton.
PSR is still quite new and seemingly only going to get tighter, hopefully levelling the playing field and enabling Levy's long term vision to come to fruition because like it or not, he has a long term vision for the club and while we fans want instant success, it's not possible unless we're crooked.

Hopefully, we've seen the last of clubs buying their way to success in the way that Man City have and Chelsea before them.
Newcastle are an example of this, one of the richest clubs in the world but unable to spend vast amounts of money because the new rules are restricting them.

Our spending has increased since the stadium has been up and running and we're now in a very strong position to take advantage of the financial plight many clubs have found themselves in.

So yes, it's been a long and frustrating journey but with any luck, our patience is about to pay off.

I can't subscribe to this idea that Levy doesn't want to win things and is happy being fourth every season because success only builds his brand more.

What do you think we have been doing for the last ten years?

 

[alfie103]

That's what we are trying to do from what I can see? We needed to increase our revenue streams to a similar level as theirs first though, and that is where the stadium has come in. Since then we have clearly been putting in a structure (new recruitment team, revamp of the youth setup etc, Scott Munn etc...) behind the scenes to help us achieve sustained success. We've only been in this post covid, new setup, additional revenue stream world for about 2-3 seasons so let's just see how we go before writing it all off.

Well Arsenal and Liverpool have also focused on cup competitions enough to win them, it seems fairly clear we prioritise our league finish over any cup competition we are in.

When do you think the club to be in a position compete with teams like Arsenal and Liverpool?

 

[Styopa]

Well Arsenal and Liverpool have also focused on cup competitions enough to win them, it seems fairly clear we prioritise our league finish over any cup competition we are in.

When do you think the club to be in a position compete with teams like Arsenal and Liverpool?

Yeah I think this is undeniable. Rightly or wrongly, and we have improved lot since I was a young man, we have put a massive emphasis on finishing fourth over anything else. That’s been the defining feature of Levy’s tenure.

 

[Neon_Knight_]

you are right of course about the salary/bonus. Do we know what performance goals he hit to double his money? And thereby double that of his peers?

I don't know, but I imagine it was linked to the club's financial performance. Achieving all-time high revenue and increasing the club's monetary value will almost certainly have been big factors.

Buck stops with Levy, especially at that money, surely- whether on the quality of the due d done on Tanguy, as club record signing and a massive risk for a club 1bn in debt?

Yes, the buck stops with him, but that means he deserves praise for successes, as well as blame for failures / underachievement. There seems to be a trend for him to get lots of credit for the mistakes and little/none for successes.

The fanbase seems to largely want Levy to be more removed from the footballing / transfer decisions - instead intrusting that to others. It's rather hypocritical for the same fans to then criticise him for trusting those people and giving them the funds they demand for the players they want.
When he blocks a transfer, fans criticise him for "not backing the manager", even though plenty of the players he's refused to cough up for over the years have gone on to have fairly mediocre careers elsewhere.
When he approves a transfer, he doesn't get any praise if the new signing is successful, but takes the brunt of the blame if they don't live up to hopes/expectations.

If Levy had (rightly, with hindsight) refused to sign off on the purchase of Ndombele, fans would have complained that he wasn't backing the manager by signing his no.1 target. Having agreed to the deal, which fans where for the most part delighted about at the time, he's still being hammered for it 5 years later. If he hadn't agreed to the deal, I'm almost certain that we'd be citing it as the reason for the team's decline under Poch, even with the hindsight of Ndombele failing to excel elsewhere. However well an alternative signing potentially would have done, Ndombele would have kept coming up in discussion as someone who could have been even better and given us that extra 1% to win a trophy / secure top 4 etc.

Lo Celso was chosen over Bruno Fernandes. Not by Levy, but by Poch. So Levy signed Poch's no.1 target, but gets blamed for not having signed his no.2 target instead.
For context, following Lo Celso's strong run of form post-lockdown, Mourinho was also very vocal about rating him above Fernandes.

Bergwijn was a player who Mourinho wanted. Sessegnon was a player who Poch wanted. Levy was also blamed for wasting money on both of them during the same period as Lo Celso & Ndombele.

Edit: Levy got the blame for us ending up with Aurier as our only senior RB, but it was Poch who pushed out Trippier (in full knowledge that it meant an underperforming Aurier would need to become first choice).

When was the last time someone on SC gave Levy credit for a successful signing? That credit always goes to the manager / Director of Football / whichever scout identified them as a key target.
When was the last time that anyone on SC gave Levy credit for appointing the aforementioned employee who was responsible for a successful signing? (There was some praise for recruiting Paratici, but SC was far more vocal about this appointment being a huge mistake once Paratici got banned, so I find it hard to count that).

When we signed Porro, at Conte's request, people were quick to jump on Levy for taking too long (despite Porro clearly wanting to delay the deal until after a cup final) and were also quick to blame Levy when Porro seemed a poor fit for the system. I don't see Levy getting much retrospective credit, now that Porro is doing well.

When we sign a cheaper / younger option than a perceived primary target, Levy always gets criticised on SC - even when it's confirmed that the cheaper / younger signing was the preferred option of the manager / scouting team. Vicario and VDV are two recent examples of that, where very few fans would now want the "better" alternative player instead. Bentancur and Kulusevski were criticised as bargain basement deals for out of favour players, but subsequently proved fans wrong. Sarr came in completely under the radar and has become a key player. There have also been cases where a cheaper / younger singing hasn't worked out, but Levy has been backing what the manager / his recruitment team favoured (e.g. Sessegnon).

 

[SirHarryHotspur]

Terrible record in cups , league cup semis 2007 and 2019 , league cup finalists 2002, 2008, 2009, 2015 & 2021. FA Cup semis 2001, 2010, 2012, 2017, 2018 , Champions League final 2019, players and managers must try harder, all Levy's fault as usual , did he bribe the players not to win apart from 2008.