Racist abuse in our stands, we need to face it if it’s there.

[CowInAComa]

It's called waiting for evidence and proof before we cast down a verdict of guilty, one of the absolute cornerstones of Western Civilisation. Which part of that is hard for you to understand?

I think i struggled to understand the part where you implied the 'non-white' guy didnt understand how things work in our 'civilised' society. And that racism really isnt all that bad compared to say rape or murder so whats the big deal really, oh and anti racism is just 'hysteria'?

please help me understand.

Also youve literally only just signed up today too.. you see that alot;, people who sign up to social media platforms and immediately start posting long rambling right wing stuff these days... call me cynical.

 

[SugarRay]

What? What have you been watching for the past 6 weeks? Immigration was barely even mentioned, the election was mainly about 'getting Brexit done' as the slogan was.

I'm sorry, but this is all ridiculous. The absolute state of this country, the media, pundits, our political class, Twitter and the 'anti-racist' mob. There is zero evidence or proof that anyone made monkey chants. No cameras picked up it, no smartphones or microphones recorded it, no stewards heard it, no fans in the same area heard it, no other players heard it, the managers didn't hear it. Nobody heard it because it's highly likely that Rudiger mishead booing and jeering and because of the racism hysteria that is being whipped up by certain elements of our society he mistook it for monkey chants. Easily done in a stadium of 50,000 people making noise and chanting so i'm not calling him a liar. For him to have heard monkey chants from that distance away somebody would have to be bellowing it, everybody around the person would have heard it, not just Rudiger alone. Yet it seems that nobody else did, so how does that make any sense?

In a civilised society we wait for proof and evidence before we cast down a verdict of guilt, apparently when it comes to accusations of racism from a member of a non-white ethnic group that standard no longer applies. The hysteria and over-reaction to this is absolutely insane, its as though a fan ran onto the pitch and put a knife into Rudiger. Why on earth is Downing Street commenting on this? Why on earth are the PFA releasing such a statement before waiting for evidence? Why on earth are the media going full whack pitchfork mode before waiting for confirmation that it actually happened?

If it did happen then its madness and the person responsible should be banned for life, but what is even more madness is this ludicrous level of 'racism hysteria' and over-reaction by those with a political and ideological motive to do so. Let's not beat around the bush, that is a clear part of this from some. We have a Tory government and voted Brexit, and many who are politically opposed to these things are using these claims as a way to say our society is seeing a massive increase in racism and pin it on them.

We are now at a point in our society where even accusations of racism such as this with no proof or evidence to validate the claims seem to be treated on par with, if not worse than murder, rape, or violent physical assaults. From the media reaction you would think 'racism' is the worst possible crime a human being can ever commit. It's absolute madness, total hysteria. Shame on those of you fuelling it before waiting for actual evidence that it happened. That is not how it should work.

Aside from everything else you’ve pointed out, a lot of which I agree with by the way, my point was the election was all about Brexit, and Brexit was all about immigration.

 

[Gassin's finest]

Aw no, we're gonna get another bloody brexit/politics thread now aren't we?

 

[rio bryan]

If you want to use the "where is the evidence" defence you are going to trip yourself up. Because there's plenty.

First result on Google: https://www.searchlightmagazine.com/2018/01/fla-the-mask-slips/

Searchlight know their shit when it comes to Britain's pretty stupid far-right activists.

Now stop denying the obvious.

Nice try but the guy highlighted in the article was i believe thrown out of the DFLA awhile ago but even so there was no quotes of racism from him and that is from a left wing publication, anyway keep up the good work.

 

[double0]

I sit in the Paxton and whilst being at the other end of the stadium I can't comment on the chants. However, I can comment on the moron sitting 3 seats away from me who managed to construct a sentence with a swear, homophobic slur and a racial slur. I genuinely turned around to my mate and ask if he said what I thought he said. I have been going to games for around 10 years and have never heard such things, it put a extra sour note on a what was already a terrible day. The thing is you can't confront these people because they are so moronic that they can't take criticism and their only form of response is either violence or abuse.

Have no fear.

You have a right to say your piece constructively if it's offensive.

 

[rio bryan]

Ok, 98% was based on immigration ( Brexit )

 

[poc]

Aw no, we're gonna get another bloody brexit/politics thread now aren't we?

Yep some of these posts are getting ridiculous

 

[gerishep]

I think i struggled to understand the part where you implied the 'non-white' guy didnt understand how things work in our 'civilised' society. And that racism really isnt all that bad compared to say rape or murder so whats the big deal really, oh and anti racism is just 'hysteria'?

please help me understand.

Also youve literally only just signed up today too.. you see that alot;, people who sign up to social media platforms and immediately start posting long rambling right wing stuff these days... call me cynical.

In the interests of balance this equally applies to left wing stuff.

 

[CowInAComa]

In the interests of balance this equally applies to left wing stuff.

You'll have to point on the account on here that has just signed up today and has immediately done this. In the interests of balance

 

[HodisGawd]

Nice try but the guy highlighted in the article was i believe thrown out of the DFLA awhile ago but even so there was no quotes of racism from him and that is from a left wing publication, anyway keep up the good work.

It's an anti-racist publication, that hunts racists. Hence why it is talking about the FLA.

Calling it "left wing" doesn't invalidate the facts.

Nice try. But your argument is pathetic.

 

[gerishep]

Said it yesterday in the match thread, people will let the media drive this which is fucking ironic considering some of the broadcasters and publications that'll hand the pitchforks out.

State of this country.

Guardian already ramping it up.

 

[rio bryan]

Have to laugh at all the snowflakes on here who are claiming that the DFLA are a racist group but at the same time would have supported Corbyn in the recent GE, a man who is an anti-semite of the highest order,anyway i hope you told your fellow jewish Spurs supporters who you voted for

 

[Shadydan]

Why can't you just say racism exists in football and we need to root it out?

What does it matter if Rudiger was mistaken or not in that particular instance? There were fans in our ground yesterday who are racists and who hurl racist abuse. We all know that. You'd have to be incredibly naive not to have heard it at some point.

So let's use this opportunity to crack down on it, hard and thank Rudiger for raising what is an on-going issue in every ground in the country including, I am ashamed to say, ours.

As for hysteria, come on. Racism exists and affects people. Don't minimise that or you are as bad as the racists themselves.

Yeah I'm pretty sure I've been affected by racism as a black person but thanks for pointing that out to me - I've been a victim myself many times either overt and covert incidents (which is far worse and harder to prove) so please don't take that stance with me and at least try and comprehend where I'm coming from. There is obviously racism in football and it's deplorable but my point is we need to be careful how we treat these cases, especially since there is literally no evidence of racial abuse and we are seemingly going by one persons word. We don't need a case like this without evidence to tackle racism because it totally misses the point we need the authorities to get up off their arses and start to deploy tactics to eradicate the issue, be proactive not reactive.

Why does it matter if Rudiger was mistaken or not in this particular instance? Why does it matter if a alleged rapist was accused of raping someone by their victim are we going to believe them just because rape happens? What a bizarre stance to take, how are we meant to take one person's opinion when he was a good distance away from the stand which no one else seems to have seen it, as much as I want to believe Rudiger and know exactly what position he is in that just doesn't sit right with me.

It's incidents like the racial abuse at the Manchester derby where the person was seen to make a monkey gesture to players or Sterling being abused at Chelsea, there is enough evidence there to react to it and come down hard on it. The incident yesterday is nothing like what happened those times.

I've never seen such a total over reaction to an incident without evidence, I know why people are over reacting because they want to be seen as a taking a stance, whether they feel some sort of guilt of the past or whether they want speak out because of the subject is currently flavour of the month but people just need to get a grip really and take a step back, yeah thanks for eventually cottoning onto the fact that black players get abused at football matches but please don't treat all incidents the same and go off on a wild tangent especially since you literally have no evidence, it's nonsense.

 

[Archibald&Crooks]

Can people not have a debate or disagree in a manner that's not provocative? Words like pathetic, snowflakes and all that shit, this thread is going nowhere fast, it's just going to turn into a bickering cock joust with an underlying tone that's well, unsavoury to say the least............either leave that shit at the door or you'll be shown it.

 

[eViL]

Anyone else hear the Levy legal team's papers shuffle?

 

[Gassin's finest]

As mentioned, SSN are going overboard with it because of the presenters' ill judged "balance" caveat in the middle of Gary Neville's comments.

If he hadn't done that, then I bet that Sky wouldn't be tripping over themselves so much, to try and reverse the appearance he gave that Sky isn't fussed about racism.

With the tensions in this country right now, it's all about appearing to be proactive.

 

[punkisback]

Have to laugh at all the snowflakes on here who are claiming that the DFLA are a racist group but at the same time would have supported Corbyn in the recent GE, a man who is an anti-semite of the highest order,anyway i hope you told your fellow jewish Spurs supporters who you voted for

The issue there is that you are seeing things in black and white; and think that all people who are left wing support Corbyn. This isn't a left v right issue, it's a racism vs non racist issue and I know what side I would rather be on.

What do you think the DFLA stand for?

 

[HodisGawd]

Yeah I'm pretty sure I've been affected by racism as a black person but thanks for pointing that out to me - I've been a victim myself many times either overt and covert incidents (which is far worse and harder to prove) so please don't take that stance with me and at least try and comprehend where I'm coming from. There is obviously racism in football and it's deplorable but my point is we need to be careful how we treat these cases, especially since there is literally no evidence of racial abuse and we are seemingly going by one persons word. We don't need a case like this without evidence to tackle racism because it totally misses the point we need the authorities to get up off their arses and start to deploy tactics to eradicate the issue, be proactive not reactive.

Why does it matter if Rudiger was mistaken or not in this particular instance? Why does it matter if a alleged rapist was accused of raping someone by their victim are we going to believe them just because rape happens? What a bizarre stance to take, how are we meant to take one person's opinion when he was a good distance away from the stand which no one else seems to have seen it, as much as I want to believe Rudiger and know exactly what position he is in that just doesn't sit right with me.

It's incidents like the racial abuse at the Manchester derby where the person was seen to make a monkey gesture to players or Sterling being abused at Chelsea, there is enough evidence there to react to it and come down hard on it. The incident yesterday is nothing like what happened those times.

I've never seen such a total over reaction to an incident without evidence, I know why people are over reacting because they want to be seen as a taking a stance, whether they feel some sort of guilt of the past or whether they want speak out because of the subject is currently flavour of the month but people just need to get a grip really and take a step back, yeah thanks for eventually cottoning onto the fact that black players get abused at football matches but please don't treat all incidents the same and go off on a wild tangent especially since you literally have no evidence, it's nonsense.

I am saying racism exists in football and we should root it out. And you are arguing with that. What the fuck??? Get a grip and work out what side of the fence you are on.

The undertone to so many posts here is that Rudiger must be mistaken and/or is lying. I do not accept that until it is found otherwise. The allegation has been made and Rudiger has offered his witness evidence. We have HIS evidence and the evidence that we all know that it is more than plausible, more than likely, in fact, inevitable that it happens in our ground. Unless the club comes out and says it simply didn't happen, we need to tackle this.

Why are you quibbling with that?
What is controversial there?
Why do you not just want to stamp out racism at Spurs???

 

[Gb160]

The undertone to so many posts here is that Rudiger must be mistaken and/or is lying. I do not accept that until it is found otherwise. The allegation has been made and Rudiger has offered his witness evidence. We have HIS evidence and the evidence that we all know that it is more than plausible, more than likely, in fact, inevitable that it happens in our ground. Unless the club comes out and says it simply didn't happen, we need to tackle this.

Do you mean the club or the fans?

 

[yiddopaul]

In a crowd of 60,000 there's always going to be the odd racist. In every country in the world, there's always going to be racist people. Thankfully they are in a very small minority. Unfortunately, all it takes is 1 idiot to shout something out, and the whole club gets tainted. With technology now available to everyone, lets record said person(s) reveal these individuals and the punishment must be hard, from the club and the courts. Nip it in the bud, now. This is the behaviour we expect from Chelsea, not us.