Is there a way back this time?

[LeParisien]

Agree on the whole, think Dier should be kept though. Like him at centre back and think he has the character we need moving forward.

Alli won't be going anywhere as nobody will bid what we want for him.

Dier hasn’t been bad at CB. Is he worth 120k a week if the reports are true ? Or could we spend 100k a week and guarantee ourselves Malang Sarr on a free.

I’d keep Alli for a year and flog him for 40m next year when there’s a bit more money around. This squad needs shaking up.

Don’t see any of this happening but it should.

 

[EastLondonYid]

I warned alot on here.and other spurs forums to be careful what you wish for.....and that was in relation to getting rid of Poch.
Poch was never Fergie,wenger or bill nick i get that.....but he was not the problem, and was left hung out to dry by Levy.....
There is noway Poch,after where he took us,and the journey we had should have been ditched , he should have been backed!

Now we are in this fucking mess......and i know it will get worse before it gets better unfortunately, as i bleed spurs and it hurts...
I don't recognise us, 2 seasons ago we were the envy of everyone, now we are a joke.

 

[Wadec]

Dier hasn’t been bad at CB. Is he worth 120k a week if the reports are true ? Or could we spend 100k a week and guarantee ourselves Malang Sarr on a free.

I’d keep Alli for a year and flog him for 40m next year when there’s a bit more money around. This squad needs shaking up.

Don’t see any of this happening but it should.

Very good question in regards to Dier, I would love Sarr and to keep Dier if we were able to. Think Toby and Sanchez would be put the door before Dier for me.

Agree about Alli and that the chances of what we need happening are slim.

 

[Timberwolf]

My prediction is that Mourinho will leave either mid-way through next season or at the end of it. His shit performances will turn the fans against him, we'll limp along in mid table with average results without ever being truly disastrous, but eventually it will become clear we're not getting anywhere and Levy will bite the bullet. Or maybe Jose will just completely implode like he did at Chelsea and Utd. Either way he'll be gone.

What comes next will be the measure of whether there's a way back.

That next managerial appointment will be absolutely key. Bring in the right man and we could restart a new project that maximises the genuine talent left in the squad (i.e. Lo Celso, Ndombele (maybe), Bergwijn, Sanchez, Sessegnon, Skipp, Tanganga, Alli etc) with a sprinkling of key additions, hopefully including whoever we bring in this summer. We're bound to lose at least 1 or 2 of our big players (Kane, Son, etc) but should get some good money for them to reinvest in the squad.

If we bring in the right man and spend well, we could be back in the race for CL.

If we bring in the wrong man and spend badly, we could be looking at a rehash of the 90s only with craft beer instead of budget lager.

 

[HildoSpur]

Brilliant OP - we really have been through it haven't we guys? We should start a Spurs supporter's support group.

We are clearly in the early stages of what will be another transformation of the club. We have at least 2 years of rubbish to go through before hopefully we get ourselves sorted out and back up playing with the big boys. The problems we have are that in Jose we have a guy who is used to getting success quickly and is not known for rebuilding a team and we also have Kane coming into his prime years who will not want to wait 2 years for possible success.

To put it bluntly we are fucked and there are going to have to be big changes and most likely some painful decisions made before we see any light at the end of the tunnel. It feels a long, long way away at the moment but with football you never know, so much is down to confidence - one good run of results can change everything.

 

[WiganSpur]

My prediction is that Mourinho will leave either mid-way through next season or at the end of it. His shit performances will turn the fans against him, we'll limp along in mid table with average results without ever being truly disastrous, but eventually it will become clear we're not getting anywhere and Levy will bite the bullet. Or maybe Jose will just completely implode like he did at Chelsea and Utd. Either way he'll be gone.

What comes next will be the measure of whether there's a way back.

That next managerial appointment will be absolutely key. Bring in the right man and we could restart a new project that maximises the genuine talent left in the squad (i.e. Lo Celso, Ndombele (maybe), Bergwijn, Sanchez, Sessegnon, Skipp, Tanganga, Alli etc) with a sprinkling of key additions, hopefully including whoever we bring in this summer. We're bound to lose at least 1 or 2 of our big players (Kane, Son, etc) but should get some good money for them to reinvest in the squad.

If we bring in the right man and spend well, we could be back in the race for CL.

If we bring in the wrong man and spend badly, we could be looking at a rehash of the 90s only with craft beer instead of budget lager.

In that scenario I think you're better off keeping Jose in the job unless we're threatened with the drop. We'd need as wide a pool of coaches available as possible and to get that you're realistically waiting until the following summer. Maybe Levy could spend this time doing due diligence on potential caretaker options in case things do get so bad that we have to cut ties mid season.

 

[Snarfalicious]

In that scenario I think you're better off keeping Jose in the job unless we're threatened with the drop. We'd need as wide a pool of coaches available as possible and to get that you're realistically waiting until the following summer. Maybe Levy could spend this time doing due diligence on potential caretaker options in case things do get that bad that we have to cut ties mid season.

 

[wrd]

All it takes is a couple of signings and getting lucky with some youth players coming through to turn things around - That's not to say we don't need a rebuild, we do but in terms of simply turning around the negative slide we just need a couple of signings. Our squad has a weak mentality and even if I don't agree with the current tactics, I don't think anybody has a stronger winning mentality than Jose and you would hope he can transfer that into the players.

I think the owners need to take some risks in the market and not get left behind or else we'll not only have a 50 mill champions league hole in our wallet every season but we won't be in a prime position for things such as stadium sponsorships the longer the slide continues.

 

[punkisback]

I think we need to rely on the youth team for a lot of these replacements. Buying first team players are so expensive and we can't afford to do this for every position, we have so many positions that need depth or upgrade. But right now we have so much rubbish that the youth players should be able to compete with them.

 

[hellava_tough]

What some don't appreciate, is Levy is putting in the pieces to make sure that we're able to keep bouncing back.

You can't avoid buying bad players, signing the wrong manager and having dips in form.

But if you have a state of the art training ground and academy, and a world beating stadium that draws revenue from other activities, we should always have the resources to rebuild when on field performance dips.

Winning trophies is obviously the ultimate goal for everyone. You can't ever guarantee that, but I fully expect us to come back from the last 12 months stronger. The question is whether it's with or without Jose, and how quickly.

I broadly agree with that.

Still think we need to do A LOT better in the transfer market though.

Otherwise we're always going to risk these dramatic declines every 4 or 5 years.

 

[hellava_tough]

Added to my post above, we kept some absolute dross on the books for years, because Levy didn't get his initial asking price.

That was a complete joke as well.

 

[wrd]

I want to elaborate on my couple of signings can turn things around post;

I think if we sign a DM; let's say for arguments sake it's Højbjerg then we're signing a player who you would does several things for us.

Firstly he is tactically aware of where to fill in the gaps in a way that Winks and Sissoko seemingly do not do, I'm talking specifically about those type of positions where teams are getting to the byline pulling us apart because our deep midfielders are closing those pockets examples recently being Pogba vs Us and the 2nd goal conceded against sheffield.

So already that's going to benefit the centrebacks who are getting dragged out of position to compensate for our midfielders. This will also benefit Winks as he can finally stop being put in a position he is clearly not comfortable. It'll benefit Lo Celso and Ndombele because we can finally two them in the role of an 8 with less reliance to try and fill that gap with the duo of Winks and Sissoko. This will in turn benefit the strikers because our creative midfielders can not only get on the pitch but also take up positions where they can create more incisive passes.

So if you're creating a list of players who benefit from one signing you're looking at;

The CB pairing whomever it is
Winks getting to move away from the deep role and compete with Lo Celso/Ndombele
Ndombele and Lo Celso both being able to play at the same time
The forwards

That is a staggering list of the team who benefit from 1 signing.

Then you look at signing a new RB. Now you would presume we will benefit defensively from this so immediately the CB's are not being dragged out of position. It would mean we no longer need to sacrifice a creative midfielder so that Sissoko has to babysit the RB hole causing more issues in the midfield and it means we could possibly reverse things so that Sessegnon could come in and act as a wing back; which might give Davies a rest. This could mean a new lease of life for Dele because he could start as the 3rd man of an attacking front 3 and drift inside knowing Sess would occupy that space and Dele would then be playing off of Kane and in spaces difficult to pick up; his speciality and Kane would benefit immensely as he always has done from that partnership.

Look at the list of players who benefit from just two signings. The whole squad would improve individually benefiting from those adjustments. If you then add in a possible back up Striker for Kane; A possible new CB because although the DM might fix things we still seemingly lack some quality there and you've really turned the squad around.

Then you add in Tanganga, Skipp, possibly you see Cirkin step up meaning we don't need to sign a LB, maybe Harvey White is a midfield gem who can take set pieces.

It doesn't take much to turn things around quite frankly. We won't be challenging City and United but it could be enough to stop the rot during the Covid-19 debacle at the very least have our competing for top4 which at this moment in time would be a step in the right direction.

 

[Goobers]

This rebuild is probably more likely to succeed given our infrastructures than past ones but that is over a long period. That's the key. This squad has been left to decay to the point that Fergusons' Utd was when he squeezed one last drop out of them before quitting.

 

[Goobers]

I want to elaborate on my couple of signings can turn things around post;

I think if we sign a DM; let's say for arguments sake it's Højbjerg then we're signing a player who you would does several things for us.

Firstly he is tactically aware of where to fill in the gaps in a way that Winks and Sissoko seemingly do not do, I'm talking specifically about those type of positions where teams are getting to the byline pulling us apart because our deep midfielders are closing those pockets examples recently being Pogba vs Us and the 2nd goal conceded against sheffield.

So already that's going to benefit the centrebacks who are getting dragged out of position to compensate for our midfielders. This will also benefit Winks as he can finally stop being put in a position he is clearly not comfortable. It'll benefit Lo Celso and Ndombele because we can finally two them in the role of an 8 with less reliance to try and fill that gap with the duo of Winks and Sissoko. This will in turn benefit the strikers because our creative midfielders can not only get on the pitch but also take up positions where they can create more incisive passes.

So if you're creating a list of players who benefit from one signing you're looking at;

The CB pairing whomever it is
Winks getting to move away from the deep role and compete with Lo Celso/Ndombele
Ndombele and Lo Celso both being able to play at the same time
The forwards

That is a staggering list of the team who benefit from 1 signing.

Then you look at signing a new RB. Now you would presume we will benefit defensively from this so immediately the CB's are not being dragged out of position. It would mean we no longer need to sacrifice a creative midfielder so that Sissoko has to babysit the RB hole causing more issues in the midfield and it means we could possibly reverse things so that Sessegnon could come in and act as a wing back; which might give Davies a rest. This could mean a new lease of life for Dele because he could start as the 3rd man of an attacking front 3 and drift inside knowing Sess would occupy that space and Dele would then be playing off of Kane and in spaces difficult to pick up; his speciality and Kane would benefit immensely as he always has done from that partnership.

Look at the list of players who benefit from just two signings. The whole squad would improve individually benefiting from those adjustments. If you then add in a possible back up Striker for Kane; A possible new CB because although the DM might fix things we still seemingly lack some quality there and you've really turned the squad around.

Then you add in Tanganga, Skipp, possibly you see Cirkin step up meaning we don't need to sign a LB, maybe Harvey White is a midfield gem who can take set pieces.

It doesn't take much to turn things around quite frankly. We won't be challenging City and United but it could be enough to stop the rot during the Covid-19 debacle at the very least have our competing for top4 which at this moment in time would be a step in the right direction.

I agree with lots of that. European football makes a lot of different ein y opinion to the development and evolution of that side too and the development of key younger players working in that system like Walcott, KWP ?, Cirkin, Japhet, Gedson, Winks, White, Parrott, Bennett etc etc.

 

[wrd]

I agree with lots of that. European football makes a lot of different ein y opinion to the development and evolution of that side too and the development of key younger players working in that system like Walcott, KWP ?, Cirkin, Japhet, Gedson, Winks, White, Parrott, Bennett etc etc.

If we use the young players sensibly (i.e not 7/8 youths per game) in Europa then I'd really look forward to Europa matches, if we run our first team into the ground by not rotating correctly then I'd rather avoid the whole thing.

 

[punkisback]

Brilliant OP - we really have been through it haven't we guys? We should start a Spurs supporter's support group.

We are clearly in the early stages of what will be another transformation of the club. We have at least 2 years of rubbish to go through before hopefully we get ourselves sorted out and back up playing with the big boys. The problems we have are that in Jose we have a guy who is used to getting success quickly and is not known for rebuilding a team and we also have Kane coming into his prime years who will not want to wait 2 years for possible success.

To put it bluntly we are fucked and there are going to have to be big changes and most likely some painful decisions made before we see any light at the end of the tunnel. It feels a long, long way away at the moment but with football you never know, so much is down to confidence - one good run of results can change everything.

Agree our set up right now is tailored for the short term but the players aren't suited for it. I think Levy has always had a view that assets in football; namely the quality of the playing squad appreciate and never really has in mind what our rivals our doing. For him if you achieved the position you did last year, we should be able to do the same this year with the team we had. It's why we signed Nelson and Saha, why Jol was told to make a correction that he should come 4th and why Poch wasn't backed several times.

 

[robin09]

I broadly agree with that.

Still think we need to do A LOT better in the transfer market though.

Otherwise we're always going to risk these dramatic declines every 4 or 5 years.

The good news is, there's no mystery as to how we can improve.

We need the success rate of the players we sign to be higher. Better scouting and talent spotting needed. Also, we need to maybe sign more players already playing in England, lower leagues etc.

We also need to manage the young players who come through the academy much better. KWP, Parrot and Skipp are just 3 examples of piss poor man management, and lack of long term strategy, which means the resources and talent have been wasted or at least delayed/hampered.

Lastly, we probably can never again afford to go consecutive transfer windows without signing a first team quality player. Like Levy learned a harsh lesson when Campbell left on a free, we need to learn from this lesson that a consistent refreshing of the first team squad is essential.

I think the biggest factor is still how wealthy a club is. Luckily we're now in a very stable position for the future. Get through the next few years of paying down some more of the stadium, get a naming rights deal, maybe some events deals for the stadium, and we'll have a permanent advantage over 75% of the clubs in the Premier League.

 

[Gassin's finest]

 

[danielneeds]

Dier hasn’t been bad at CB. Is he worth 120k a week if the reports are true ? Or could we spend 100k a week and guarantee ourselves Malang Sarr on a free.

I’d keep Alli for a year and flog him for 40m next year when there’s a bit more money around. This squad needs shaking up.

Don’t see any of this happening but it should.

Is there any guarantee that Sarr would adapt to the PL and perform, though? Maybe he would, maybe not. £120k isn’t even that much these days for a player of his experience.

 

[coy-spurs1882]

only if a takeover by a sugar daddy