Hey, ho, conspiracy...

[Ungifted]

Hey all,

Firstly please allow me to introduce myself, new here, long time Spurs fan and season ticket holder but just haven't bothered with Forums up until now.

Second items is the legendary conspiracy talk I see on her and after yesterdays Newcastle Defeat (feels like that) I am not surprised...

Firstly let me say I am very much on the fence about this but I have had suspicions for a long, long time.

I mean for years I have been told they even themselves out but I have yet to see...

1. Anything like the Mendes Goal even itself out against us.
2. Opposing GK sent off in first half for winning the ball and putting it out for a throw (Gomes @ UTD).
3. Goals disallowed for Offsite despite ball being played whilst in own half (Super Jan).
4. Goals disallowed for opposition for a handball which only occurred as a result of a foul on the attacking player (Lucas last season).
5. Goals for other top four teams ruled out for Handball in lead-up (Chelsea this weekend), I mean he brought the ball down with his hand within 10 seconds of them scoring but that's deemed not in the build up, the ball never left the box!!!
6. Spurs being allowed to take a Free Kick 5 yards in front of foul (Everton week 1), same game ref pushed Sonny back off the pitch to take a cross for a FK, didn't seem even to me then or now.
7. Spurs players Diving Headbutt an opposing player to win a FK!
8. God knows how many more things over the past 20 years or so I am not forgetting.

Now I am not saying we haven't had any luck with decisions because I know we have, but I don't remember getting any Win's from decisions which they regularly seem to cost us, in fact I seem to recall loads of fans giving us shit a few years ago over a Delli dive which got us a penalty for 4-0, they seem to be happy to 'even out' the decisions when we've already run away with it?!

But my memory is far, far from the best and much like customer service, you only tend to remember the Bad so I am not sold on this whole thing yet, however many do seem to be.

So my suggestion if this, start recording all the events, note date, incident, score before \ after incident and any other related items to the incident, I.E. Maybe we didn't concede but we had a player send off wrongly 5 mins in which ruined our chance before it started, all this has to be noted accurately and ideally with evidence, GIF's or whatever as it could be years down the line you go back over it.

This needs to be done fairly and Objectionably for incidents which go for us and against us, it's the only way, you leave out items which go against us someone will find one and you won't just look silly nobody will believe any of the rest of it.

Gather enough evidence, then it can be reviewed and properly debated, investigated or whatever, I would also suggest doing a 1 team league table, year or year which shows points gained \ lost over that season.

If you can show consistency that we lose out there is a case if not conspiracy THEORIES are all they will ever be in which case you may as well be talking Aliens & how JFK Shot Dianna!!!

In the mean time we just have to suck it and blame our own inability to finish games which lets admin is a far, far more consistent theme!

Thanks

Stuart.

[He's Fat, He's White, He's Full of Fucking Shite, Pier's Morgan, Pier's Morgan!]

 

[Gb160]

I cant help but feel all the conspiracy talk is a bit Rawky, especially the alternative league table thing...they actually did that.
I think we just have shitty refs.

 

[Spursmatty87]

Tbf we should of had yesterday’s game done and dusted, the forwards need to take some responsibility for that.

Every team can point to things that have gone against them but maybe that’s part of the mentality problem at spurs. Feel sorry for ourselves rather than using that energy to fight back(obviously no time yesterday). The Cl final was a great case in point we conceded early and never really came back.

 

[walton]

No conspiracy. Terrible handball rule which is affecting everyone. Including our opponents.

We've won and lost by VAR, same as everyone. Sure, we may have had more against us than other teams, but that's always going to be the case at points over the course of its use. Give it a few months/years and that situation could have reversed.

 

[Gassin's finest]

I cant help but feel all the conspiracy talk is a bit Rawky, especially the alternative league table thing...they actually did that.
I think we just have shitty refs.

Mike Dean was 4th official... I can never rest easy when that guy is around.

 

[hughy]

We do seem to be somewhat of an unofficial test subject for VAR.

We've had the first big CL call (away against City), the first big PL call (away against City... Lol), the first "offside by a slightly uncut toenail" (Son v. Leicester), one of the first nonsensical accidental hand balls leading to a disallowed goal when our player was fucking fouled (Lucas v. Sheff U) and 2 of the first 3/4 big hand-ball calls (Doherty v. Southampton and Dier v. Newcastle).

I think in the most part we have just been unfortunate as opposed to it being any kind of conspiracy theory.

Edit: BTW welcome to SC.

 

[nicdic]

I don't think there's a conspiracy against us, but I do think we seem to have been disproportionally affected by VAR/refereeing decisions.

I think Jose's point yesterday, made before and after the game about different penalty areas having different treatment is 100% true. The penalties that we don't get awarded vs. the ones that get awarded against us and for our opponents (particularly United and Liverpool) is ridiculous. Even the first two penalties for Leicester yesterday, we've had numerous incidents like that where we won't get one and it's talked about by the media and pundits as a correct decision, but when it's Vardy it's immediately clearly labelled as stone wall.]

The battle of the bridge our players in the second half lost the plot a bit, but the ref let Chelsea off with loads in the first half, and most of it was never revisited.

The idea that these things even out is a fallacy. People who get the decisions say this, but it doesn't even itself out. It just doesn't.

Last season players in consecutive games should have been sent off for challenges against Tanganga (Liverpool and Watford), never properly looked at, or looked at but not given.

Gio makes a bad tackle in the Chelsea game, could have gone either way, but as soon as VAR stuck with the yellow, there is outrage with the pundits and media calling for VAR to comment and say they got it wrong. WHY?!

 

[Ungifted]

I tend to agree guys if you read it all I am not saying there is one, simply fed up of all the conspiracy talk I hear and thought I would offer a suggestion to confirm \ deny it.

Something I don't think anyone will do as I am not sure anyone is really that convinced it's true instead I think some just like to have it as something else to complain about when VAR isn't enough lol, but we'll see.

 

[Tucker]

There’s no conspiracy against Spurs, plenty of other clubs get fucked over by refereeing dec we just don’t focus on them.

I do think some clubs get favourable treatment however, United get far too many penalties for it to be a coincidence.

 

[stov]

Common sense suggests that its just shitty refs and lawmakers.

Can't help shake the thought that organised crime and gambling in Asia has an influence on some of the outlandish decisions and results. Its not unprecedented.

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

No conspiracy. Terrible handball rule which is affecting everyone. Including our opponents.

We've won and lost by VAR, same as everyone. Sure, we may have had more against us than other teams, but that's always going to be the case at points over the course of its use. Give it a few months/years and that situation could have reversed.

Agree.
It meant Palace lost yesterday instead of drew just like today we had victory snatched away from us, was equally as harsh on palace yday and others previously, the rule is just wrong and needs to change.

 

[nicdic]

Common sense suggests that its just shitty refs and lawmakers.

Can't help shake the thought that organised crime and gambling in Asia has an influence on some of the outlandish decisions and results. Its not unprecedented.

don’t think anyone would suggest other teams don’t also get bad decisions. But it’s silly to ignore the amount of bad decisions we seem to get, on top of things like fixture pile ups that only we seem to ever have to deal with.
Glad Jose has started to put some pressure on about it.

 

[Wick3d]

Officials I imagine are just as confused. You need to remember they are human as well. They work with what they have. The rules can be difficult to understand, especially with the way it is written, there is too much room for interpretation. Still remember that the rule makers are also trying to write and create rules which are clear, but that is not the case. Classic age-old business problem, a lack of clear communication from all sides, and then no one is taking responsibility. Everyone is hiding.

These bad decisions will affect everyone. Even Steve Bruce after the game acknowledged that, which is why he was so vocal about the penalty. They really need to try and help the officials make the correct decisions. Perhaps VAR needs to be altered again, so that it focuses purely on offsides, only clear and obvious errors, and does not take into account handballs.