Dele Alli at Everton

[nailsy]

Problem is. Those arguing is Deles case has nothing other than stats and moments of brilliance in his defense. Why? Because there’s simply no other good arguments for him.

But there are arguments for him and they've been stated, just like the arguments against him have been stated. The real problem is that judging football is all about opinions. Some people like Dele. They like his movement, that he can score incredible goals, that he's one of the few players we've got that can produce a moment of jaw dropping magic that makes going to a game worthwhile so they can ignore the way he loses possession or any of his other faults. Other people are more about the team dynamic and think he detracts from that. They'll argue that the goals and the moments aren't enough to make up for what he lacks in other areas. Either way it's all about opinions, not facts so all this stuff about proving people wrong is just a waste of breath on both sides.

 

[nailsy]

Yeah but I'd say that in his time with us, he's been a bloody good player and has shown he's got talent.
I agree that he's not been at his best for a while but he's only 23 and has had a meteoric rise to fame to deal with. To go from a kid at MK Dons, to one of the hottest youngsters in Europe, in the space of what, 2 years? That's gonna put a strain on anyone, it's a lot of pressure to deal with.
I just think that we should stick with him, rather than write him off, or use him as a scapegoat for our current overall shitness.

I mean looking at SC at the moment, our entire team is shit and we should sell them all, even Harry ffs.

One of the things that keeps being asked is whether Dele's improved since he's been here, which I think is a fair question. I'd say there were signs of improvement in the first two years, but not much since. Whether that's down to the injuries, or being played out of position I couldn't say. It is a mistake to think that improvement is linear though. Personally I want to see how he develops under a new manager and a new set of coaches. It's easy to forget that Poch and his team are the only top flight coaches he's really played under (I'm not including those he's worked with at International level as the coaches don't really get enough time to develop the players) and it's possible that he will respond positively to new methods and kick on to a new level.

 

[McFlash]

One of the things that keeps being asked is whether Dele's improved since he's been here, which I think is a fair question. I'd say there were signs of improvement in the first two years, but not much since. Whether that's down to the injuries, or being played out of position I couldn't say. It is a mistake to think that improvement is linear though. Personally I want to see how he develops under a new manager and a new set of coaches. It's easy to forget that Poch and his team are the only top flight coaches he's really played under (I'm not including those he's worked with at International level as the coaches don't really get enough time to develop the players) and it's possible that he will respond positively to new methods and kick on to a new level.

That's a really good point - I hadn't even thought of the fact that he's only really been coached by Poch.
It'll be really interesting to see how he goes over the next year, a new way of doing things might be just what he needs.
If he can learn well from Jose's tactical knowledge, he could come on in leaps and bounds.

 

[swarvsta]

I just don't see it with him, yea the goals stats and the moments of brilliance but I don't think it's enough. I really don't think we can win things with him as our no10. Maybe he needs to play deeper and get back to basics.

Weirdly, I actually totally disagree with you on this. I actually think the opposite is true now.

He just doesn’t have the legs required to play deeper. He lacks pace AND acceleration. His passing is also way too poor to play deeper in midfield. He actually doesn’t have a great technique when it comes to striking a ball. He struggles to generate any power at all.

BUT... I am still somehow a fan of Dele. His movement in the final third is truly excellent. He makes a lot of runs that do not get picked out (they used to more so by Eriksen).

I really feel he is worth a go playing up top whilst Kane is out. He could push onto the last defenders and cause problems with his movement, aerial threat and movement. His finishing is a strong trait also, so it would suit this role.

I really think it is worth a shot.

 

[Gassin's finest]

He's starting to wind me up.

 

[The Long Suffering One]

In an ideal world, I would sell him and bring in Bruno as replacement. I'm done with him to be honest. Not sure Jose's admission that he has no doubt that Dele is his outright no. 10 has done the team and Dele any favours judging by his form and performances.

 

[Deleted member 29446]

He's starting to wind me up.

Welcome across the border

 

[Gassin's finest]

Welcome across the border

I don't get it.

 

[teedee]

Dele is a baller too, that flick pass assist for Moura to get the winning goal against Ajax was poetic. I don’t think nobody else in our squad would be capable

Wasn't that pass a misguided one that just fell perfectly. This was claimed at the time and Alli didn't deny it.

 

[Martinhotspur]

I don't get it.

He thinks you have joined the Dele bashers. They usually meet in here after a defeat.

 

[-Afri-Coy-]

Would swear we were arguing about Lingard in here if his name wasn’t coming up, Dele is a special talent. He doesn’t have to have the complete locker room of skills to be considered a good player.

Stats ARE relevant, and goals/assists win games. Not a class touch, not the technique, not the powerful shots, not the cross field passes, not the pace or acceleration, but the goals and only the goals actually win games. Yes these can be contributing skills to getting goals and assists, but they are not the only skills that can achieve it.

The only reason it’s being magnified is to suit an anti-Dele narrative some of you have against him. I won’t bother mentioning the traits he actually possesses because they’ve been mentioned a thousand times here already but he has many. Look at the positives, and they far outweigh the negatives with him. The fact that he has scored and assist goals and a decent number at his age, means in one way or another the has contributed directly to the results we got on the day.

What I’m trying to get at is that no matter how frustrating he can be at times, or how many mistakes he makes, as long as he is contributing to the build play, directly scoring goals or assisting his teammates he has his name etched into the team sheet for me. Let him find his feet again under Mourinho and I bet he’ll be back on his upward trajectory. He hit a speed bump in his development, he didn’t drive off a cliff.

 

[ajspurs]

He frustrates the hell out of me, but he has his positives and he is still young. My annoyance does come from a lot of his performances but mostly how he's become indispensable to the starting 11. A lot of his performances just don't warrant that IMO.

It could even become detrimental to him as a player, if he keeps getting selected time after time when putting in poor performances. I think him being dropped momentarily will light a bit of a fire up his arse and he'd come into games with an attitude and something to prove. In saying that though he really needs to start getting the ball out of his feet and making decisions quicker and that should come regardless.

 

[double0]

I think Dele is great. What fails to get mentioned is his work rate, the amount of sprint and pressing he does. He must be one of the fittest players in the league , you couldn’t label Dele as lazy.

 

[Vincent30]

Would swear we were arguing about Lingard in here if his name wasn’t coming up, Dele is a special talent. He doesn’t have to have the complete locker room of skills to be considered a good player.

Stats ARE relevant, and goals/assists win games. Not a class touch, not the technique, not the powerful shots, not the cross field passes, not the pace or acceleration, but the goals and only the goals actually win games. Yes these can be contributing skills to getting goals and assists, but they are not the only skills that can achieve it.

The only reason it’s being magnified is to suit an anti-Dele narrative some of you have against him. I won’t bother mentioning the traits he actually possesses because they’ve been mentioned a thousand times here already but he has many. Look at the positives, and they far outweigh the negatives with him. The fact that he has scored and assist goals and a decent number at his age, means in one way or another the has contributed directly to the results we got on the day.

What I’m trying to get at is that no matter how frustrating he can be at times, or how many mistakes he makes, as long as he is contributing to the build play, directly scoring goals or assisting his teammates he has his name etched into the team sheet for me. Let him find his feet again under Mourinho and I bet he’ll be back on his upward trajectory. He hit a speed bump in his development, he didn’t drive off a cliff.

Why is Dele considered a special talent. He has been fortunate enough to play in the best Tottenham squad for years and have the luxury of a complete free role where i would be expecting any decent player with movement and finishing to get goals and assists, it's literally the only thing he does, which people will argue as being enough but it's really not.

Do Liverpool, City, Bayern, Juventus, Barca, Real etc have a luxury player like this.... of course not, their 'luxury players' are the likes of Messi, Ronaldo, Bale, Salah, Hazard, B Silva etc, these are what you call special talents and i find it bizarre how people act like Dele is so special, as he is no where near these players level.

When we lost Bale or Modric, that hurt, because every Spurs fan knew it was near impossible to replace them, if Dele goes there are so many players to replace him.

He is so average at most parts of the game for an AM, dribbling, speed, maintaining possession, none of these are better than average. Just looking at yesterday, he fucks up a one on one and has the chance to redeem himself with the most simple square ball to Lamela is standing all alone in the middle for a tap in and he shoots and misses. Pathetic. That is not a special talent, he plays like a spoilt brat and every time i see him on the team sheet i sigh. I just don't get him and how he will ever add any balance to our attacking play.

 

[double0]

Why is Dele considered a special talent. He has been fortunate enough to play in the best Tottenham squad for years and have the luxury of a complete free role where i would be expecting any decent player with movement and finishing to get goals and assists, it's literally the only thing he does, which people will argue as being enough but it's really not.

Do Liverpool, City, Bayern, Juventus, Barca, Real etc have a luxury player like this.... of course not, their 'luxury players' are the likes of Messi, Ronaldo, Bale, Salah, Hazard, B Silva etc, these are what you call special talents and i find it bizarre how people act like Dele is so special, as he is no where near these players level.

When we lost Bale or Modric, that hurt, because every Spurs fan knew it was near impossible to replace them, if Dele goes there are so many players to replace him.

He is so average at most parts of the game for an AM, dribbling, speed, maintaining possession, none of these are better than average. Just looking at yesterday, he fucks up a one on one and has the chance to redeem himself with the most simple square ball to Lamela is standing all alone in the middle for a tap in and he shoots and misses. Pathetic. That is not a special talent, he plays like a spoilt brat and every time i see him on the team sheet i sigh. I just don't get him and how he will ever add any balance to our attacking play.

What do you feel are Dele’s strengthens and weaknesses ?

Do you feel at the age of 23 his reached his peak?

 

[danielneeds]

Why is Dele considered a special talent. He has been fortunate enough to play in the best Tottenham squad for years and have the luxury of a complete free role where i would be expecting any decent player with movement and finishing to get goals and assists, it's literally the only thing he does, which people will argue as being enough but it's really not.

Do Liverpool, City, Bayern, Juventus, Barca, Real etc have a luxury player like this.... of course not, their 'luxury players' are the likes of Messi, Ronaldo, Bale, Salah, Hazard, B Silva etc, these are what you call special talents and i find it bizarre how people act like Dele is so special, as he is no where near these players level.

When we lost Bale or Modric, that hurt, because every Spurs fan knew it was near impossible to replace them, if Dele goes there are so many players to replace him.

He is so average at most parts of the game for an AM, dribbling, speed, maintaining possession, none of these are better than average. Just looking at yesterday, he fucks up a one on one and has the chance to redeem himself with the most simple square ball to Lamela is standing all alone in the middle for a tap in and he shoots and misses. Pathetic. That is not a special talent, he plays like a spoilt brat and every time i see him on the team sheet i sigh. I just don't get him and how he will ever add any balance to our attacking play.

But apart from all of that, you quite like him, don’t you?

 

[littlemandefoe]

Why is Dele considered a special talent. He has been fortunate enough to play in the best Tottenham squad for years and have the luxury of a complete free role where i would be expecting any decent player with movement and finishing to get goals and assists, it's literally the only thing he does, which people will argue as being enough but it's really not.

Do Liverpool, City, Bayern, Juventus, Barca, Real etc have a luxury player like this.... of course not, their 'luxury players' are the likes of Messi, Ronaldo, Bale, Salah, Hazard, B Silva etc, these are what you call special talents and i find it bizarre how people act like Dele is so special, as he is no where near these players level.

When we lost Bale or Modric, that hurt, because every Spurs fan knew it was near impossible to replace them, if Dele goes there are so many players to replace him.

He is so average at most parts of the game for an AM, dribbling, speed, maintaining possession, none of these are better than average. Just looking at yesterday, he fucks up a one on one and has the chance to redeem himself with the most simple square ball to Lamela is standing all alone in the middle for a tap in and he shoots and misses. Pathetic. That is not a special talent, he plays like a spoilt brat and every time i see him on the team sheet i sigh. I just don't get him and how he will ever add any balance to our attacking play.

10000% agree

 

[Vincent30]

What do you feel are Dele’s strengthens and weaknesses ?

Do you feel at the age of 23 his reached his peak?

Pretty clear from my post, no?

Strengths, when played in a team where he has zero responsibility other than to make runs into the box and get on the end of things. He is a semi decent finisher and can score the odd wonder goal.
Decent instincts in the box

Weaknesses, everything else.
Not a team player
Lacks decent dribbling skill
Lacks pace
Lacks hold up play
Poor at retaining possession
Not very dynamic in that he can literally only perform as a second striker with zero responsibility
Not a leader
Not a great passes
Takes way too many touches
Not great a pressing with intention like Lamela / GLC

I could go on, but its plan to see. This is why he has disappeared from England. In football Sancho is way more of a special talent than Dele and way younger, so not sure what the 23 reference is about really? You'd have thought he would have matured, but he dives more and his decision making has decreased with age, again, i'll reference the easy square pass to Lamela in the last game again.

I'm not enjoying going in on a Tottenham player, but i strongly feel he is a huge detriment to the team and our progression. He is a complete enigma.

 

[bubble07]

That fuck up when clean theough v boro was disgraceful. Something no professional player with the attribute to score and assist would do

 

[double0]

Pretty clear from my post, no?

Strengths, when played in a team where he has zero responsibility other than to make runs into the box and get on the end of things. He is a semi decent finisher and can score the odd wonder goal.
Decent instincts in the box

Weaknesses, everything else.
Not a team player
Lacks decent dribbling skill
Lacks pace
Lacks hold up play
Poor at retaining possession
Not very dynamic in that he can literally only perform as a second striker with zero responsibility
Not a leader
Not a great passes
Takes way too many touches
Not great a pressing with intention like Lamela / GLC

I could go on, but its plan to see. This is why he has disappeared from England. In football Sancho is way more of a special talent than Dele and way younger, so not sure what the 23 reference is about really? You'd have thought he would have matured, but he dives more and his decision making has decreased with age, again, i'll reference the easy square pass to Lamela in the last game again.

I'm not enjoying going in on a Tottenham player, but i strongly feel he is a huge detriment to the team and our progression. He is a complete enigma.

Your points are how you see it however I differ from them.
Not a team player is way off the mark.
Dele's pace though not electric he’s no slouch and covers high mileage in games.
Lo Celso has a better pressing game than Alli is unfounded as yet he hasn't been here long enough to judge.
Dele is not a leader hmm? Who is in our squad... is Son Moura Eriksen leaders?
The myth Dele can’t operate in various roles is silly because he has been tasked with much more ground work especially with Eriksen spitting his dummy out.

Personally his an asset not a detriment or enigma...stats will tell you a more balanced opinion.