We fluked it to the final ffs. It wasn’t some genius management that got us there. We were all Over the place against Ajax first leg, didn’t turn up then. 3 nil down at halftime away. I wish people would stop using the final as some sort of validation of Pochs managerial ability. It was a freak occurrence and we didn’t even win the thing!! How small time to celebrate getting to a final and losing. Small time!
Poch: In or Out? - You CAN change your vote
- Thread starter rez9000
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We fluked it to the final ffs. It wasn’t some genius management that got us there. We were all Over the place against Ajax first leg, didn’t turn up then. 3 nil down at halftime away. I wish people would stop using the final as some sort of validation of Pochs managerial ability. It was a freak occurrence and we didn’t even win the thing!! How small time to celebrate getting to a final and losing. Small time!
coy-spurs1882
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- Aug 31, 2012
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it wouldn't be unless we won that
double0
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We've lost a lot of games with that CB pairing. We've lost a lot of games without Dier. We've lost a lot of games too with the Sissoko Winks partnership there's many factors but for me looked at how Tottenham have been playing I'm not at all confident with our CB pairing. Anytime they are squared up they get beat for skill, ran at them one on one they get beat for pace. What are Vertonghen and Toby strengths as pure defenders?
double0
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So what should we do?
wrd
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- Aug 22, 2014
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Question for my fellow Poch-inners
If Poch decided to say fuck it, he's going to write this season off in order to prepare for the next one and that means the likes of Aurier, Alder, Vert, Rose being dropped for the likes of KWP, Sanchez, Foyth, Sessegnon in order to develop them. Would you be happy? Obviously I can't imagine all 4 are causing big enough problems but if he decided to drop 2-3 of these from now on to focus on the development of the players he plans on being him next season at the expense of this season would you stick it out until the end or would it be the straw that broke the camels back?
I ask as I don't know how I'd feel about it.
If Poch decided to say fuck it, he's going to write this season off in order to prepare for the next one and that means the likes of Aurier, Alder, Vert, Rose being dropped for the likes of KWP, Sanchez, Foyth, Sessegnon in order to develop them. Would you be happy? Obviously I can't imagine all 4 are causing big enough problems but if he decided to drop 2-3 of these from now on to focus on the development of the players he plans on being him next season at the expense of this season would you stick it out until the end or would it be the straw that broke the camels back?
I ask as I don't know how I'd feel about it.
Hakkz
Svensk hetsporre
- Jul 6, 2012
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I think that's relevant because their CL run was pretty fluky as well.
mrlilywhite
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It's a moot point imho - the real proof will be at the grounds, as that is where it is most highlighted and if last night is anything to go by - the message is well and truly being heard and given that 55% are likely just waiting to play out time it could well be reversed come what Saturday at about 2pm.
Thewobbler
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- Oct 29, 2016
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This Brighton game is massive. I just don't want a win I want a great performance. If poch can't get the players fired up after that humiliation then I'm not sure what he can do.
They owe us.
They owe us.
double0
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I'd love Poch to be more brave in this aspect. You shouldn't be getting beat at home 7 goals conceded, unfortunately that has exposed a deep rooted flaw it's happed on the biggest stage and can happen again and certain players those especially with contract issue and ones the club want rid of can wash their hands because they'll be off on Bosman's while others pick up the pieces.
If Poch can be brave enough to side line certain players Eriksen Toby Jan Wanyama Rose Aurier completely away from the first team and start from now building another team with the promotion of Skipp Tanganga Parrott Walker-Peter Foyth Sanchez Sessesgnon Lo Celso Ndombele etc bring Clarke back i'd accept that but it won't happen.
Poch should go back to 4231 or try 433 and stick with those system
soup
On the straightened arrow
- May 26, 2004
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Along with the ITK from Trix, I don't see how he can stay if that's how the majority of players are feeling.
I'm of the mind that almost any other manager out there could do better than Poch at the moment. How far we've come isn't exclusively down to him, it's also down to the amazing squad of players we currently have. It's our golden generation and it's being hamstrung by the constant dramas surrounding the club.
2 years ago it was all about the team, the squad, the harmony and you could see it, it was working. Then all of a sudden it became about Poch and has been ever since. Will he leave? Where will he go? Is he happy? Is he not? Does he have the players he wants? Does he want to be coach or manager? Does he have a say in transfers or not? Does he get on with this guy? Or that guy? Has he fallen out with Levy? Is he still depressed about the CL final? I mean, if you guys think Mourinho is a drama queen, you should check out our own manager. He's almost following the same track, personality-wise, charming as hell on moment and then a complete dick the next, but minus the results. Our current predicament reminds me somewhat of the heartache Chelsea fans went through when it became time to let him go.
We're a sinking ship whose captain has said he wants to jump off. Whatthefuck are the rest of the crew to feel? They probably feel like if it's okay for him then why not for them? And I'd suggest that surprisingly why no hearts are in it at the moment. It's not rocket science!
He's got to go. It's sad, but there's certainly no sentiment from him and the current mentality surrounding him, and just because he's a likable guy, doesn't make him the messiah.
My time was up with him before the CL final, but I thought he might get his head straight and start afresh this year, but no, more of the same boring football with shitty excuses. I've had enough of the bloke.
I'm of the mind that almost any other manager out there could do better than Poch at the moment. How far we've come isn't exclusively down to him, it's also down to the amazing squad of players we currently have. It's our golden generation and it's being hamstrung by the constant dramas surrounding the club.
2 years ago it was all about the team, the squad, the harmony and you could see it, it was working. Then all of a sudden it became about Poch and has been ever since. Will he leave? Where will he go? Is he happy? Is he not? Does he have the players he wants? Does he want to be coach or manager? Does he have a say in transfers or not? Does he get on with this guy? Or that guy? Has he fallen out with Levy? Is he still depressed about the CL final? I mean, if you guys think Mourinho is a drama queen, you should check out our own manager. He's almost following the same track, personality-wise, charming as hell on moment and then a complete dick the next, but minus the results. Our current predicament reminds me somewhat of the heartache Chelsea fans went through when it became time to let him go.
We're a sinking ship whose captain has said he wants to jump off. Whatthefuck are the rest of the crew to feel? They probably feel like if it's okay for him then why not for them? And I'd suggest that surprisingly why no hearts are in it at the moment. It's not rocket science!
He's got to go. It's sad, but there's certainly no sentiment from him and the current mentality surrounding him, and just because he's a likable guy, doesn't make him the messiah.
My time was up with him before the CL final, but I thought he might get his head straight and start afresh this year, but no, more of the same boring football with shitty excuses. I've had enough of the bloke.
wrd
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- Aug 22, 2014
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Agreed, also think @Shadydan is right that we need to do it in stages. I'd probably start with Foyth and Sanchez for Aurier and then you have to decide which CB is causing more issues, that decision bringing Sanchez in will add more heat to Poch in the short term. Sessegnon can be integrated when he's back from injuries. I must admit I forgot about Skipp but he needs to be given the opportunity for that shield role and rotate with Dier, although I imagine Dier is one of those who there's issues with.
mrlilywhite
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- Sep 1, 2008
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Jeez - why don't most understand that it has no impact what bloody formation you put out there!? Right, last night - for the first 30 mins we started with a diamond, you know the one we all hate so much right? The first 30 mins of the game we were looking like our old selves again and playing with a high press, high intensity - we were knocking on the door and it was only the brilliance of Neuer that kept them in it! After 30-35 mins Poch switched it up to a 4-4-2 and the rest is bloody history. The thing is why was the diamond working then and the 4-4-2 after wasn't? It was because of the system(s) to sum up - first 30 mins we looked brilliant and playing the counter-press, the very same system that Poch started his journey with us. After 30 mins? Totally gassed and exposed midfield. System of play? Revert back to present-day type.
It doesn't matter what formation you want, it only works when you have the system to play it in. The formation is just a framework - it's the things inside the formation that make it work or not.
If you take anything away from any of this, is that that right now the Poch counter-press has entered Bielsa burnout and we just don't have the players to make it work even for 30+ minutes. The only question you need to ask yourself is, can poch utilise any other system that, A: Wins games, B: Keeps players onside and C: doesn't get him the sack!
McFlash
In the corner, eating crayons.
- Oct 19, 2005
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But that's glossing over the past year's downturn in form.
Like I said, I'm not advocating Jose but to say that it's only 4 games worth of issues is just not true.
The problems have been there for a lot longer than the past few games and surely, even the most ardent Poch fan can see that?
double0
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Ask yourself a question. Has Poch been backed in the transfer market. Secondly the players downing tools are obviously players seeing there contracts out and ones Poch wanted to sell...but hey Levy is Levy. You bring any manager in now he'll still have to shift a lot of player imo
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McFlash
In the corner, eating crayons.
- Oct 19, 2005
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I'm still kind of undecided as to whether I'm in or out, probably more out at the moment.
But to answer your question, in a roundabout way, then probably yes. As long as he swallows his pride and ditches the fucking diamond!
I'd still worry about his tactical nous though, and I never really used to, before the past year or so.
mrlilywhite
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- Sep 1, 2008
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1. Does getting his targets this season count? Sess? Lo Celso & N'Dombele? Furthermore, it was Poch who was being an arse regarding unattainable targets being the only ones that could improve the team. ITK confirmed.
2. The players downing the tools are the ones who don't believe in him and it's more than just your usual contract rebels. Once again ITK confirmed.
But hey Levy, being Levy, so carry on....
