Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou

[DiscoD1882]

Good teams don’t care what other teams do because they believe their system works against any team. This is what Ange believes. We can’t judge this on one season with players that don’t necessarily fit the system. There are obviously areas that need addressing. I think we can see that. But I’m certainly not throwing in the towel. We need a decent CF. Who can hold up play and bring the others in. Without that. We can’t play the way he wants. We also need to get away from the wengeresque way of thinking we can pass teams to death. Without someone who can regularly score form outside the box. It just means possession with no purpose. Things to work on. But are we better than last year. Are we enjoying football more than last 3/4 years. And the awnser to that is a big yes.

 

[beats1]

Sorry but the idea that any random youngster will be better than Bissouma, Hojbjerg, Maddison or Son is absurd. I want to see our youth too, but come on.

I disagree to an extent, we have seen over the years our youth players given a chance do well, when I mean a chance, I mean with the first team not a depleted Europa squad

Man Utd best player this season has been an 18 yo CM who has been given a chance ahead of bigger names

Right now, we have no winger at the club imo that is comfortable out wide who can go either side past a player. Son when he plays up top, if he is getting no service, is basically playing like a man down

Im not saying these players should be starting but they deserve more than got especially when Richarlison was out

Over the year, regardless of manager, we have played square pegs in round holes much to the detriment of our first team and the development of our youth players

 

[Sp3akerboxxx]

Good teams don’t care what other teams do because they believe their system works against any team. This is what Ange believes. We can’t judge this on one season with players that don’t necessarily fit the system. There are obviously areas that need addressing. I think we can see that. But I’m certainly not throwing in the towel. We need a decent CF. Who can hold up play and bring the others in. Without that. We can’t play the way he wants. We also need to get away from the wengeresque way of thinking we can pass teams to death. Without someone who can regularly score form outside the box. It just means possession with no purpose. Things to work on. But are we better than last year. Are we enjoying football more than last 3/4 years. And the awnser to that is a big yes.

Arsenal literally just played against our weaknesses.

 

[dontcallme]

Dropping Bissouma was the right call, but Maddison also needs some time on the bench.



Completely agree with this apart from the fact we don't need a "specialist" set piece coach. We just need the ones that are there currently to rewatch the last 10-15 games, realise it isn't working and try something new.

Liverpool used to be a fully zonal team, then klopp tweaked it so that they are now a mix of man to man and zonal. Put your best headers defensively on their best headers from an attacking sense.

It's not rocket science, but last week we had Pedro fucking Porro up against Dan Burn and we done sweet fuck all to change it.

I didn't say we do need one. I just said we can't keep conceding from set pieces on such a regular basis.

 

[dontcallme]

I get where you are coming from to be honest. Great guy but the more time he has spent here the worse we have looked. Like you say teams have adapted to how we play and other than the odd half or moment ina game we look really poor.

I hope it's down to injuries and internationals and just needing to get the right players in but your concern is warranted IMO.

I get the concerns. I think talk about him leaving is very premature though the prediction could be right. Football moves very quickly.

I think we just have to hope Ange has a chance to analyse the season and put some things right then have a good transfer window and we get back on track.

I very much disagree with this idea that "teams have found out how we play." It's hardly a secret. Most teams have a style of play. We just have to do it better.

 

[Trix]

Liverpool still do zonal marking to be fair.

They do and they don't. They sort of half do it in that they have 5 players around the 6 yard box and 3-4 who disrupt runners. It's quite different to what we have been doing. I've been very careful to keep saying we are playing a full zonal system. The idea behind it is that it is supposedly an easier position to counter from when you win the ball back because your players are spread, which is why I guess Ange is persisting with it.

As I've said all the way through I'm all for having specific players marking areas as long as you have others whose role it is to pick up and/or block the runners. Up until the second corner went in we were not doing that. After half time we did look a little more flexible with Sarr helping the keeper and others looking to block runners at the back post. Hopefully that was the wake up moment we need.

 

[Impspur1]

Gone by October, his tactics have been sussed out and he has no other plan

Really sorry but couldn’t disagree more, Arteta has had 5 years and an absolute fortune to shape his team and we were still competitive. We’ve beaten some top sides this season and lost to some too. We cannot keep having this attitude of hiring and firing a manager. It’s clear he has a unique way of playing that most agreed start of season needed a certain skill set of players and these would take more than a season to get in. Im going to give him next season and see if we are continuing to progress as we have.

 

[spurs mental]

We love to do comparisons and a lot of people seem convinced that we look similar to early klopp/Arteta/Pep.

In reality it all looks very 'Arry Redknapp to me.

H had some major game changers though, we only really have Sonny who is unfortunately on a downward trajectory. As much as we all love him. We had Kane alongside Son for a long time too.

Bale, Lennon, VDV could all turn a game themselves and all played together.

We need some more game changers.

 

[G Ron]

Don't worry -we will have fixed our defensive issues by the City game - you can bet your bottom dollar we keep a clean sheet!

I won’t be going to that game as I would be willing them to score at every opportunity. We ain’t finishing 4th so let’s at least do our bit to stop the scum
Winning it. I’d let City score fifteen to get their GD up.

 

[Trix]

Dropping Bissouma was the right call, but Maddison also needs some time on the bench.



Completely agree with this apart from the fact we don't need a "specialist" set piece coach. We just need the ones that are there currently to rewatch the last 10-15 games, realise it isn't working and try something new.

Liverpool used to be a fully zonal team, then klopp tweaked it so that they are now a mix of man to man and zonal. Put your best headers defensively on their best headers from an attacking sense.

It's not rocket science, but last week we had Pedro fucking Porro up against Dan Burn and we done sweet fuck all to change it.

This

 

[ThatisSchoolboysownstuff!]

Look it’s Ange’s first season and he probably needs another pre season and possibly 3 more high quality players if we can attract them without CL football next season which are a (DM, WF & ST) alongside what we have already and I think it’s a squad that could possibly challenge. But and it’s a big but Ange HAS TO BE MORE ADAPTABLE!

I know hindsight and all that but even before today’s game as far back as when we knew Udogie would be out injured, we all knew if we played Davies up against Saka we’d be dead, we had 3 options at LB.

Option 1. Play an aging flat footed old fashioned fullback (Davies) against Saka who we all know is extremely sharp with quick feet and blistering pace. (More than risky bordering on sabotage)

Option 2. Play Van de Ven LB (has played there before) bringing in Dragusin at CB.(potentially risky)

Option 3. Emerson LB (risky) this is what I’d have gone with for the following reasons

We keep the Cuti and Micky partnership at CB also playing Emerson LB which he’s done before I think would’ve worked well, Saka constantly cuts inside onto his preferred left foot, Emerson is right footed so Saka would’ve been cutting into Emerson’s stronger side all game plus Saka rarely goes on the outside of his man & is reluctant to use his right foot I felt that was a win win scenario, Emerson obviously would still have had to defend well but for all Emerson’s faults I think we can all agree one of his best attributes is his 1v1 defending.

Both options 2 & 3 were comfortably more apt for the game today than option 1.

Ben Davies much like Eric Dier & Michael Dawson before both have all been great servants for the club but Ben Davies isn’t good enough for where we want to be now. Surely Ange has to know this?

From his 1st season in charge it’s clear to see Ange isn’t very adaptable which I feel all the top/elite managers are. Pep, Klopp, Luis Enrique the godfather (Don Carlo) hell even Arteta & Mr good Ebening have shown they’re willing to tweak,adapt or adjust, even change the way they set their teams up or play at certain times/periods of a season or even for specific games. Whether it be formation wise personel or just making sure your hard to break down and not out of a game within the first 38 minutes like we was today. (slightly harsh as we did ok 1st half)

It’s glaringly obvious that this Kamikaze attack,attack, attack approach needs adjusting so that we’re not so open to counter attacks and just generally have a more sound defensive unit especially when we’re attacking/in possession. Watching us this season there seems to be no defensive Structure whatsoever we literally rely on last ditch tackles/blocks or for Micky to bail us out with his speedy recoveries. Even the poorer teams in the league have created many chances against us this season, It’s not sustainable.

Also I feel with the personnel we have in this squad we’d be much better suited, more balanced playing a 433 high energy/pressing game similar to Liverpool, we have 4 good CM’s 5 if you include GLC yes we need a DM, but picking 2 from Bissouma, Sarr & Bentancur alongside a proper DM next season is pretty decent. We have Son, Johnson, Kulu, Solomon & possibly Werner/new Winger. To play the wide positions with Richy up top unless we’re able to offload him and upgrade. It won’t happen I know as Ange is to stubborn but I really do feel it’s the route we be should taking.

Now I know some of you will be thinking what about Maddison but I’m sorry apart from the 1st 10 games this season where the majority if not all the team was playing well, sorry to say he’s been shite ever since. My personal opinion is luxury #10’s don’t work in today’s football. Now people will say what about Odegaard or De Bruyne they play as 10’s but for me both are levels above Maddison, also de Bruyne has the worlds best DM Rodri sitting behind him and plays in possibly the best team in world football & Odegaard has the 2nd best DM (Rice) & the most sound defence in Europe behind him which allows both to not be on it in some games. Maddison has always been very patchy with his form great when he’s in a purple patch but an absolute passenger when out of form as he offers nothing defensively.

Plus one more thing that bugs me about Ange, he keeps saying top 4 doesn’t matter it’s about the longer term project etc which I do kind of understand but had we have qualified for the CL for next season it guarantees us more revenue no?…and probably makes us an even more attractive proposition for potential signings which to me equates to us potentially being able to sign a better standard of player right?…we know that the better standard of player you have raises the levels of the squad all round and everyone in football will tell you if you have good players it’s easier, so how does not qualifying for CL help or not matter to us?… it doesn’t make sense.

 

[Oh Teddy Teddy]

Really sorry but couldn’t disagree more, Arteta has had 5 years and an absolute fortune to shape his team and we were still competitive. We’ve beaten some top sides this season and lost to some too. We cannot keep having this attitude of hiring and firing a manager. It’s clear he has a unique way of playing that most agreed start of season needed a certain skill set of players and these would take more than a season to get in. Im going to give him next season and see if we are continuing to progress as we have.

Don’t be sorry, you’re spot on — and not spouting the usual knee-jerk Twitter BS.

 

[fridgemagnet]

This

Wasn't the previous one we had quite effective?

 

[kendoddsdadsdogsdead]

We need a number 9.

If this season hasn't shown us that I don't know what will.

It’s the number one priority. We need to go as sure fire as we can in that position. It will cost us more in the long run if we try and be too clever and take a punt on someone a bit left field because they’re seen as better value. We can maybe do that in other positions but the CF has got to be ready to go from the start take us up a level type player.

 

[DiscoD1882]

They do and they don't. They sort of half do it in that they have 5 players around the 6 yard box and 3-4 who disrupt runners. It's quite different to what we have been doing. I've been very careful to keep saying we are playing a full zonal system. The idea behind it is that it is supposedly an easier position to counter from when you win the ball back because your players are spread, which is why I guess Ange is persisting with it.

As I've said all the way through I'm all for having specific players marking areas as long as you have others whose role it is to pick up and/or block the runners. Up until the second corner went in we were not doing that. After half time we did look a little more flexible with Sarr helping the keeper and others looking to block runners at the back post. Hopefully that was the wake up moment we need.

Look. I don’t believe for a second that the system we deployed today was the right one. Anyone could see they were overloading the back post and then running into near post areas. And The sunburn kid was impeeding Vicario. That should have been sorted after the first goal. We did address it in the second half but damage was done. I never think zonal is right. There is too much space to run into. And you aren’t watching what is arriving from behind you. As was proved twice today.

 

[whenstevewentup]

We are seeing identical goals and chances created against us week in week out , doesn’t matter if it’s wolves , forest or arsenal . It’s a real concern . I think we are all in agreement that if we see the same issues come December then serious questions need to be asked .

 

[T-Bone]

I absolutely am not spouting any twitter knee jerk nonsense. You tell me how I am wrong in my estimation he has been figured out and we are sitting ducks to any team. Our performances since end of October have been poor. I initially taught this was to do with suspentions and injuries but as players have returned performances have still been poor. This is pre Poch Tottenham, easy to play against and easy to beat

 

[Trix]

Wasn't the previous one we had quite effective?

Yes very effective, but I'd settle with just being more effective at set pieces whilst continuing to work on everything else over dedicating too much time to it.

Like I've said it's not a case of reinventing the wheel here. Big Sam for instance used to make relegation teams into set piece gods in the space of a couple weeks everywhere he went and he's no tactical genius.

 

[jolsnogross]

If you take away the 10 game honeymoon, we're bang average this season. Like 10th place according to a points average over a whole season that excluded that fantastic start. And we have been going backwards a fair bit in performance over recent weeks. That's a real worry - no character in the team, no shooting or crossing, far too easy to play against, like an underage side at corners.

Ange won't have as much good will with him next season for sure. He'd better make good use of the summer.

We need a high profile departure or two, with a couple high profile incoming. We can't go into big battles with the likes of Werner and Maddison as the 'warriors'. And Son can be very effective, but he’s no leader.

If we remain as easy as we are to play against, and refuse to shoot or cross because that's considered too much of a percentage game, then Ange will end up out on his ear because ideological talk only gets you so far. Anyone can talk a good game about how we should play our fottball, mate, but he's got to find the right characters to implement it.

 

[Trix]

Look. I don’t believe for a second that the system we deployed today was the right one. Anyone could see they were overloading the back post and then running into near post areas. And The sunburn kid was impeeding Vicario. That should have been sorted after the first goal. We did address it in the second half but damage was done. I never think zonal is right. There is too much space to run into. And you aren’t watching what is arriving from behind you. As was proved twice today.

Indeed. Which is why a mix of zonal and man marking shouldn't be too difficult of a way to fix things going forward.