Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou

[alfie103]

Thanks for this and I'm on the same page.
Son and Kane are elite, a coaches job at a club like Spurs is to improve that player at the level or 2 below. Conte's success generally comes when he's working with the very best. His appointment was misguided and that was on Levy.

I think the success the club is meant to be aiming for means you have to buy elite level players. I don't think any club has had sustained success at the top level without regularly spending a lot of money to do so. Spending money on its own isn't a guarantee of success but it seems to be a necessary part of it.

 

[muppetman]

So that means we can rival the likes of Arsenal, Liverpool and others when buying players? Because other people say we will never get to that level.

What has this got to do with Ange?

You hate Levy, you wish we'd spend be more ambitious and spend more money - I know, I get it, but it doesn't need to be said in every single thread!

 

[Yantino]

Managers will come and go. Modern day football shows that it's unusual for a manager to stay around for a significant period. You might get the odd one or two but in general, managers have a cycle of 3 seasons maybe 4. Players have potential to be around for longer than the manager.

Players should be signed based on who the club and it's recruitment staff think fit. And the manager at the time should also have a say in that to ensure the players' personality fits. It has to be a longer term strategy, not just based on what the current manager wants.

And this is exactly how I think we are now structured.

 

[PLTuck]

Managers will come and go. Modern day football shows that it's unusual for a manager to stay around for a significant period. You might get the odd one or two but in general, managers have a cycle of 3 seasons maybe 4.

Players should be signed based on who the club and it's recruitment staff think fit. And the manager at the time should also have a say in that to ensure the players' personality fits. It has to be a longer term strategy, not just based on what the current manager wants.

And this is exactly how I think we are now structured.

I saw an article about 6 months ago that did the maths on it and since 1992 the average tenure of PL managers is just over 18 months, which is mental.

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

100% so the question always comes back to why hire them if you aren't going to back them? Ange isn't all that different to either Conte or Jose, in that he is uncompromising on his beliefs and philosophy. He isn't going to put up with penny pinching, and finding alternatives with less fit to his needs and more potential financial upside for the club any more than Jose or Conte were.

It is very clear he is not a coach who can adapt his system and work with what he is given he needs certain skillsets in his players just as much as they did. If he gets it I think we are on to a winner because of how he wants to play, if he doesn't I see inconsistent seasons ahead and another manager who becomes disillusioned with those above him,.

The recruitment lately under Ange has been absolutely fine and we have a good set up in place with Munn,Lange etc so not sure why this is being brought up now off the back of yet more Conte Q’s in the Ange thread.

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

Sorry but IMO this is very much Ange related. His style of play and philosophy are only as important as all his other traits and beliefs and how all that sync's together with the thinking of the THFC Board.

Ange is willing to stick out a long term project and he is ok with buying younger players in-line with our clubs preference, he also doesn’t think we need to spend huge transfer fees and wages, Conte didn’t tick any of those boxes .

So far in the 2 windows we’ve had so far Ange has been backed really well.

Unless we are at risk of PSR then I don’t see why that would suddenly change, yes of course it’s important we continue to back Ange as we have done so far but right now it’s a moot point as there is no evidence suggesting he won’t be backed well this summer and in further future windows, but let’s see.

 

[funkycoldmedina]

Managers will come and go. Modern day football shows that it's unusual for a manager to stay around for a significant period. You might get the odd one or two but in general, managers have a cycle of 3 seasons maybe 4. Players have potential to be around for longer than the manager.

Players should be signed based on who the club and it's recruitment staff think fit. And the manager at the time should also have a say in that to ensure the players' personality fits. It has to be a longer term strategy, not just based on what the current manager wants.

And this is exactly how I think we are now structured.

I do think wages and amortised value are going to become a bigger factor. We've seen ourselves, Man Utd, Chelsea soon, struggling to move players out and if you have a manager churn you can't hamstring them with deadwood that's near impossible to move.
That's what I like about our current approach, Sarr, Udogie, Vicario, Bergvall etc are all easy to move on if not in a new mangers plans (apart from the fact they're probably not the right manager for us) There are plenty of suitors for Gil but the likes of Hojbjerg are harder to shift.

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

I think we do need a striker, but not necessarily one that will score from nothing. We create plenty. Imo we need a clinical finisher who also has good hold up play.

Certain games we struggle to create are the ones where a striker and top class WF who can create and score out of nothing are needed imo.

 

[Trix]

I don’t think the players aren’t motivated more that they’re very tired due to coming back from injuries, international tournaments in Jan and not being used to this style of play over a full season yet.

We've played far less games than pretty much everyone this season. I'm not buying fatigue as a legitimate excuse.

 

[alfie103]

What has this got to do with Ange?

You hate Levy, you wish we'd spend be more ambitious and spend more money - I know, I get it, but it doesn't need to be said in every single thread!

My point is people are now saying we need to buy better players for Ange so we can compete with the top level clubs for the league and champions league. This is quite similar to what people were saying about Conte and others. For me, it doesn't matter who the manager is, if we want to compete with the likes of Liverpool, Arsenal and others, we need to buy the same level of players as they do and be willing to pay the money to do so (on wages as well as transfer fees). There is a reason Man City spend the money on players they do.

 

[PLTuck]

Certain games we struggle to create are the ones where a striker and top class WF who can create and score out of nothing are needed imo.

Yeah I see your point and ideally we will go and get an uber striker in the summer, but we both know that's unlikely.

Perhaps not a controversial opinion but I genuinely believe that if Kane stayed we'd be right in the mix for the title right now. I think we've forgotten how much his hold up play and playmaking created for us, and that's without his ridiculous scoring output.

 

[YB123]

The point is that pretty much every manager needs specific types of player and character to fully function, but this takes time. It's never fixed within 1-2 windows.

Ange seems to get this and it appeared for a while Conte did too. Then Conte started moaning to the press and criticising the players publicly, this only ever ends one way.

Conte was a very exciting hire and if he'd shown commitment to the long run, we'd have supported, same as most of us are doing with Ange right now.

I think Conte was upset from the off of last season.

Key positions were LCB, CM and RWB. He got a 4th Choice Barca defender in Lenglet on loan, a youngster at RWB in Spence with no Prem experience that was a club signing and a CM in Bissouma who was an opportunistic signing with one year left.

I think he had every right to be constantly pissed off. But I do also agree with many he should've done more with the tools he had.

But it doesnt change the FACT. Conte wasnt backed or supported by Levy. A pattern emerges on this front every single time.

 

[YB123]

The recruitment lately under Ange has been absolutely fine and we have a good set up in place with Munn,Lange etc so not sure why this is being brought up now off the back of yet more Conte Q’s in the Ange thread.

Think its more that its evident we need a top quality CM and Striker to truly push the top 3. Recruitment has been greta recently but the two positions you need to buy gamechangers. Rice and Macallister are mainly the reason this season why they are able to compete with City.

 

[Bluto Blutarsky]

We've seen Ange in action for almost a full season now, that's what the sane people are judging him on.

I am not sure that most are judging him on his performance - at least not the ones who are questioning his fitness for the role.

Here we are Week 32, and we have the same points - 60 - as we had in all of last season.

Our goal-differential is +16 compared to +7 last season.

I think a lot of people are judging Ange, not on where the club actually are after 32 games, but rather where those same people think they club should be.

By most metrics we are better off now, than we were last season - and this is despite losing Kane.

 

[dontcallme]

I think Conte was upset from the off of last season.

Key positions were LCB, CM and RWB. He got a 4th Choice Barca defender, a youngster at RWB with no Prem experience that was a club signing and a CM in Bissouma who was an opportunistic signing with one year left.

I think he had every right to be constantly pissed off. But I do also agree with many he should've done more with the tools he had.

But it doesnt change the FACT, Conte wasnt backed or supported by Levy. A pattern emerges on this front every single time.

Writing your analysis in capitals as FACT doesn’t make it a fact.

 

[TOLBINY]

So it was a Levy bashing you wanted?

No - it's more about the fans.

As fans we have to accept that the club is unable or unwilling to spend like the really big boys, so to re-build a squad will take more time (transfer windows) with us than it will some others. There is no magic bullet. Therefore when our manager (whoever he is as long as he is doing ok) asks for patience, as fans we have to recognise that, be patient and support him. Otherwise it is rinse and repeat and what that manager has started often gets undone by the next one in the door.

In recent weeks some have lost patience with Ange and I have seen calls for him to go, he's a one trick pony etc. With the fixtures we have coming up the results may not improve for a while, that will likely just serve to heighten the critcism of Ange. My concern is that noise from some fans takes over and the 'No Plan B' becomes the overwhelming narrative.

Ange mentioned patience last week. I think he is doing ok with half a new first team and we can all see areas where the squad needs improving further. Does he have what it takes to deliver trophies to Tottenham - like I've posted recently, I don't know becuase he hasn't Prem trophy success on his CV, but I sure as hell know we have not given him sufficient opportunity to build a squad in his image and prove it one way or the other.

 

[SirHarryHotspur]

Let's see how Ange & Co operate in the coming summer window, he has clearly stated in interviews that he only gets in players that he wants. So far he has chosen Johnson, Maddison, VDV, Dragusin & Vic, free transfer & loan so no risk for Solomon & Werner, for the future Veliz, Phillips, Bergvall and Vuskovic.
Compared to previous years a lot going on and he still wants more from some of the players that were not his choice , like Sarr & Udogie, let's see how this all pans out.

 

[YB123]

Writing your analysis in capitals as FACT doesn’t make it a fact.

In my opinion, its a fact....

 

[Gassin's finest]

I think Conte was an unwell man, lost two of his best mates, and generally had a really bad time of things... and there's not much more to it. I think he was right about us having it to easy and not wanting pressure.

But anyway, Ange Postecoglu. Top bloke, I think he needs to adapt his style a bit, but will likely stick to his guns and evolve the team. Hopefully he's proven right and it starts to really click. If we're still bollocks by December I reckon Levy will pull his usual shit.

 

[Albertbarich]

Why did we build a £1 billion stadium then?

Investment company buffering up their investment.

I'm in no doubt we're just a massive property deal to ENIC but I'm at the stage where it's pick your poison. You can get the sportswashers, the incompetents ( see Everton) or what we have. I don't like them or want them but they aren't going anywhere and the sport was taken away from the fans anyway so whoever comes in won't be perfect either.

But what we are showing is we can spend more than most thanks to the stadium and yeah we won't get the Declan Rice's of the world but with clever scouting we can get a Vicario and an Udogie and hopefully that carries on.

Progress has definitely been made.