The Formula 1 Thread

[LexingtonSpurs]

Vettel Reaction:



This of course happened after Vettel refused to drive his car down pit road, and, in fact, got out of his car and pushed it back out of the opening to pit road

 

[Thewobbler]

It's a shame that happened but it was good to see a competitive race at the front

 

[aliyid]

Tricky one,

• Did he intentionally block Hamilton? No, I don’t think he did as you can see the steering wheel never pointed right
• Did he miss the corner? Yes
• Did he impede Hamilton from overtaking him as a result of missing the corner? Yes

The penalty is fair

 

[$hoguN]

Was really pleasing to see it get competitive.

 

[$hoguN]

Personally thought it was a penalty as Vettel gained an advantage by leaving the track and returning how he did. Gave him about 1.2 to 2.0 secs. I think if this was two back markers everyone would have said the penalty was fine and moved on. The fact it has impacted the first competitive race for a while is what has people up in arms

 

[Yid-ol]

Personally thought it was a penalty as Vettel gained an advantage by leaving the track and returning how he did. Gave him about 1.2 to 2.0 secs. I think if this was two back markers everyone would have said the penalty was fine and moved on. The fact it has impacted the first competitive race for a while is what has people up in arms

I disagree it gave vettle an advantage to cut the corner, he lost time doing it. But by doing it, it lost Hamilton more time.

I think Hamilton got it correct when he said that if you leave the track you are meant to come back on not on the racing line, and then go back at a safe point. Though the commentators also said (and can see the point) that he was still fighting the car and didn't have control.

I agree that if this happened to a back marker no one would complain, and think the penalty was correct.

 

[LSUY]

I agree with Mario Andretti - the stewards are meant to punish blatantly unsafe moves, not honest mistakes that are the result of racing. Button, Hill, Mansell, McNish, Chandhok and Brundle have all said they believe it was a racing incident and the stewards have deprived the fans of a competitive race.

What happened to let them race? Imagine the penalties Gilles Villeneuve would have picked up if he were racing today.

 

[longtimespur]

I agree with Mario Andretti - the stewards are meant to punish blatantly unsafe moves, not honest mistakes that are the result of racing. Button, Hill, Mansell, McNish, Chandhok and Brundle have all said they believe it was a racing incident and the stewards have deprived the fans of a competitive race.

What happened to let them race? Imagine the penalties Gilles Villeneuve would have picked up if he were racing today.

Can't see how it deprived the fans of a competitive race as it carried on to a finish. The stewards then decided to award a 5sec penalty which changed the outcome of the GP.
Fairly or unfairly is what people will decide them selves but that won't alter that result.

 

[LSUY]

Can't see how it deprived the fans of a competitive race as it carried on to a finish. The stewards then decided to award a 5sec penalty which changed the outcome of the GP.
Fairly or unfairly is what people will decide them selves but that won't alter that result.

The stewards slapped Vettel with the five-second penalty on lap 57 of 70. The moment they did that it decided the winner. We were deprived of a race that should have gone down to the wire.

 

[SheffieldAndy]

The stewards slapped Vettel with the five-second penalty on lap 57 of 70. The moment they did that it decided the winner. We were deprived of a race that should have gone down to the wire.

From the moment the penalty was given, the competitive race should have been ‘can Vettel pull out a 5 second lead and win this’, and briefly it looked like he was trying this.
What it became, was ‘is Vettel going to fall into third’ which still added an element of competitiveness to the race imo.

 

[LSUY]

From the moment the penalty was given, the competitive race should have been ‘can Vettel pull out a 5 second lead and win this’, and briefly it looked like he was trying this.
What it became, was ‘is Vettel going to fall into third’ which still added an element of competitiveness to the race imo.

From the moment the penalty was given the race became Hamilton stick on Vettel's tail which is basically the message Hamilton received from Mercedes the lap after the penalty was announced. There was no way Vettel was going to open up a 5-second lead. That's not racing. If people want to watch drivers race a clock then they'll watch time trials.

Motorsport, especially the racing element, is overregulated. If you want competitive racing where drivers attempt to overtake then sometimes there's going to be contact. It seems the authorities want all overtaking to be clean DRS-enabled on a straight. Look at the list of ex-drivers who have publicly disagreed with the decision - Mario Andretti, Damon Hill, Nigel Mansell, Jenson Button, Martin Brundle, Alex Wurz, Mark Webber, Giedo van der Garde, Allan McNish, Karun Chandhok, Max Chilton and Jimmie Johnson. That's one hell of a list of people who know racing.

F1 is being micro-managed to death. Why bother assembling the best racing cars in the world and hiring the best drivers only to issue penalties the moment an actual race breaks out?

 

[SheffieldAndy]

From the moment the penalty was given the race became Hamilton stick on Vettel's tail which is basically the message Hamilton received from Mercedes the lap after the penalty was announced. There was no way Vettel was going to open up a 5-second lead. That's not racing. If people want to watch drivers race a clock then they'll watch time trials.

Motorsport, especially the racing element, is overregulated. If you want competitive racing where drivers attempt to overtake then sometimes there's going to be contact. It seems the authorities want all overtaking to be clean DRS-enabled on a straight. Look at the list of ex-drivers who have publicly disagreed with the decision - Mario Andretti, Damon Hill, Nigel Mansell, Jenson Button, Martin Brundle, Alex Wurz, Mark Webber, Giedo van der Garde, Allan McNish, Karun Chandhok, Max Chilton and Jimmie Johnson. That's one hell of a list of people who know racing.

F1 is being micro-managed to death. Why bother assembling the best racing cars in the world and hiring the best drivers only to issue penalties the moment an actual race breaks out?

While I disagree about it being a time trial as you still have another driver trying to put pressure on the leader to keep the gap small in real time (Hamilton got as close after the penalty as he managed before the penalty pretty much) and Vettel pulled away after the incident initially at a pace that would have won him the race even after the penalty. Both of those were results of both drivers spitting their dummies at differing times (Hamilton gave up initially before the penalty was applied, Vettel gave up after).

There have been a lot of big decisions that have been disagreed with by huge numbers of current and ex drivers over f1’s time and some of the current rules are borne out of such complaints (Schumacher taking out title rivals always pop into mind here). And lots of these incidents have had a lot more at stake than ‘a competitive race’. It’ll always be divisive as any debated decision in any sport is.

I agree that I want to see racing, and that’s why I’ve always watched f1, but by the same token, they can’t just disregard the rules because a race has broken out.

 

[Zoidy]

Think some of you are mad.

Take Hamilton's point that Vettel shouldn't return onto the racing line.
1) He wasn't in control of the car, not his fault
2) Certain corners have markers that dictate you must drive around them in order to return safely - this one doesn't.
2a) Further to this, Le Clerc didn't drive around this marker in Qualy and received no penalty ... odd but irrelevant.

I also can't agree with the gaining a advantage/maintaining a position debate. Hamilton wasn't making an overtake attempt so the position wasn't under threat.

Its true a lot of people dislike Hamilton or want a title fight, but honestly i think most people are just becoming disillusioned with F1 and the over-regulation of F1 is killing it. So even if this was the two Williams drivers, 4 laps down, it still is the wrong decision.

A final point. Hamilton being boo'ed.

People boo'ed him because he called for the penalty, he complained on the radio about it. Then told Vettel thats not what he wanted, and then tried to drag Vettel onto the top of the podium. Well the fans knew, so he got boo'ed.

 

[SheffieldAndy]

Think some of you are mad.

Take Hamilton's point that Vettel shouldn't return onto the racing line.
1) He wasn't in control of the car, not his fault
2) Certain corners have markers that dictate you must drive around them in order to return safely - this one doesn't.
2a) Further to this, Le Clerc didn't drive around this marker in Qualy and received no penalty ... odd but irrelevant.

I also can't agree with the gaining a advantage/maintaining a position debate. Hamilton wasn't making an overtake attempt so the position wasn't under threat.

Its true a lot of people dislike Hamilton or want a title fight, but honestly i think most people are just becoming disillusioned with F1 and the over-regulation of F1 is killing it. So even if this was the two Williams drivers, 4 laps down, it still is the wrong decision.

A final point. Hamilton being boo'ed.

People boo'ed him because he called for the penalty, he complained on the radio about it. Then told Vettel thats not what he wanted, and then tried to drag Vettel onto the top of the podium. Well the fans knew, so he got boo'ed.

Due to the loss of speed after leaving the track, Hamilton is absolutely trying an overtake, he’s attempting to drive around him on the racing line. Vettel pulls out onto the racing line and blocks him.
He wasn’t attempting an overtake that caused Vettel to come off, but he certainly was trying one as a result of it.

 

[chrissivad]

He wasn't in control of the car, but that was down to his mistake.
He stays on the track he stays in control of the car.

 

[LexingtonSpurs]

the over-regulation of F1 is killing it.

In the 70's and 80's - there were 16 driver fatalities in F1.

In the 2000's there have been 5.

I think the "over-regulation" has had its intended effect. Driver safety is a paramount concern - and is more important than spectators being treated to "exciting" racing full of contact between cars.

 

[sherbornespurs]

Think some of you are mad.

Take Hamilton's point that Vettel shouldn't return onto the racing line.
1) He wasn't in control of the car, not his fault
2) Certain corners have markers that dictate you must drive around them in order to return safely - this one doesn't.
2a) Further to this, Le Clerc didn't drive around this marker in Qualy and received no penalty ... odd but irrelevant.

I also can't agree with the gaining a advantage/maintaining a position debate. Hamilton wasn't making an overtake attempt so the position wasn't under threat.

It's true a lot of people dislike Hamilton or want a title fight, but honestly i think most people are just becoming disillusioned with F1 and the over-regulation of F1 is killing it. So even if this was the two Williams drivers, 4 laps down, it still is the wrong decision.

A final point. Hamilton being boo'ed.

People boo'ed him because he called for the penalty, he complained on the radio about it. Then told Vettel that's not what he wanted, and then tried to drag Vettel onto the top of the podium. Well the fans knew, so he got boo'ed.

Not true.

Vettel claimed for all the world that he didn't see Hamilton, but we now know the Race Stewards looked at CCTV footage from Vettel's car, that wasn't broadcast, that shows him checking his mirrors and assessing Hamilton's track position - before steering into his line in order to block him off. Telemetry data also showed Hamilton having to brake to avoid the collision.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/reason-vettel-punished-canada/4461461/

 

[Yid-ol]

Ferrari are apparently going to appeal the penalty.... Thought you couldn't appeal? And can't see how they can change it now, as would have changed the complexity of the race if it wasn't given at the time.

 

[Spurger King]

In the 70's and 80's - there were 16 driver fatalities in F1.

In the 2000's there have been 5.

I think the "over-regulation" has had its intended effect. Driver safety is a paramount concern - and is more important than spectators being treated to "exciting" racing full of contact between cars.

That’s the crux of it. It’s hard to be critical of an organisation that is trying to ensure the safety of those participating in their sport, especially when it’s clearly at the detriment of entertainment.

Ironically it’s going to kill F1 itself, because whilst it’s definitely a good thing that driver and crew safety is paramount, it’s all a bit sterile and dull. It has been for a while. Watched every race since I was about 8 years old, but I’ve given up on it now. Not watched a single race this season, or even the highlights. I doubt I’m the only one to do that.

 

[Spursmatty87]

vettel should given up the place and raced Lewis if you want to see a race and not a time trial. It was so poor from Vettel.