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Player Watch: Serge Aurier

Shadydan

Well-Known Member
Jul 7, 2012
38,247
104,143
@Shadydan @wrd @Sweech

I don’t want to be pushed into a place where I am railing against someone who got shot. I have said that this is a tragedy and expressed sympathy for Serge and his family. Nothing else should detract from that.

You may be reacting a bit to the feeling that I am rushing to a judgement in some right-wing manner about someone without any evidence. Fair enough. I am probably reacting to a faux-naivety that his sustained criminal past isn’t likely linked and a kind of soft bigotry that is shown to immigrant communities - « you don’t know any better, it’s not your fault ». There’s probably some truth to both perspectives.

I won’t reply anymore in here because it’s not so useful. Thoughts with his family.

So why didn't you do this in the first place and leave it at that?
 

ItsBoris

Well-Known Member
Jan 18, 2011
7,468
8,604
@Shadydan @wrd @Sweech

I don’t want to be pushed into a place where I am railing against someone who got shot. I have said that this is a tragedy and expressed sympathy for Serge and his family. Nothing else should detract from that.

You may be reacting a bit to the feeling that I am rushing to a judgement in some right-wing manner about someone without any evidence. Fair enough. I am probably reacting to a faux-naivety that his sustained criminal past isn’t likely linked and a kind of soft bigotry that is shown to immigrant communities - « you don’t know any better, it’s not your fault ». There’s probably some truth to both perspectives.

I won’t reply anymore in here because it’s not so useful. Thoughts with his family.

How do you know about that? Presumably you don't know the criminal history of all our players' siblings, so this must be something you just learned in reading this story. Not that it matters, but it seems like he hasn't been convicted of anything, so I don't see the point of speculating that his death was due to a "delinquent lifestyle".

We don't know the circumstances surrounding his death, so the only appropriate thing to say, if you're going to say anything, is that it's a tragedy and condolences to the family, etc.
 

Mark_147

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2011
1,807
3,019
Terrible news. Nobody deserves that and Serge must be distraught.

That being said, he was not a nice guy. In 2017 he planned to meet up with a prostitute with two other men. There they threatened her with a gun, used tear gas on her and robbed her. He was caught using DNA evidence. Last night he was tragically shot in a seedy bar in Toulouse.

This sort of delinquency is not something you fall into lightly and is shocking given his brothers fame and wealth. He paid the ultimate price for his bad decisions.

I hope Serge is given time to grieve. Despite his own violent behavior he is in no way responsible for his brothers wrongs.
Correct me if I'm wrong but the story from the Daily Star said allegedly.
 

Sweech

Ruh Roh Ressegnon
Jun 27, 2013
6,752
16,378
But sometimes it is.

We all assess risk and make our choices in life, the outcomes of which are then our responsibility.
1. It's incredibly disrespectful. Especially at a time like this to suddenly bring about unsubstantiated allegations to detract from a loss of life.

2. The idea that "oh well they broke the law" (again allegedly) so that we can act blase about someone's passing is disheartening to the core. It's a tragedy either way. The idea that unlawfulness makes your life worth less in the eyes of some is incredibly sad.
 

razzmaster

Well-Known Member
Jun 21, 2008
2,311
13,051
Is this thread about Serge Aurier losing a brother or people arguing about who is right and who is wrong? Whatever the circumstances it is a tragic loss of life and thoughts are with Serge and his family. There's a time and a place for bitching and in-fighting and that is matchday, in the matchday thread.
 

Mark_147

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2011
1,807
3,019
Terrible news. Nobody deserves that and Serge must be distraught.

That being said, he was not a nice guy. In 2017 he planned to meet up with a prostitute with two other men. There they threatened her with a gun, used tear gas on her and robbed her. He was caught using DNA evidence. Last night he was tragically shot in a seedy bar in Toulouse.

This sort of delinquency is not something you fall into lightly and is shocking given his brothers fame and wealth. He paid the ultimate price for his bad decisions.

I hope Serge is given time to grieve. Despite his own violent behavior he is in no way responsible for his brothers wrongs.
Totally disgraceful post that should be retracted immediately! A man is accused of a crime by a prostitute which was said but not proved and you have the cheek to come on here and find him guilty in your kangaroo court in order to besmirch his character.
According to French sources he was charged and summoned before a judge. I can’t see what happened after that but it was DNA that linked him to the crime so it’s a reasonable presumption that he was involved.

Also he was known to the police before that incident so he had a string of antisocial and criminal acts. By his own admission he fell in with the wrong people and it wrecked his chances of becoming pro.

That is the tragedy here. It’s not a smear. It’s a sad story of how his lack of focus on sport and bad choices led to a terrible outcome for him.
Yeah that's why it's alledged cause it said but not proved.
 

LeParisien

Wrong about everything
Mar 5, 2018
3,212
8,169
Wow. I regret posting because this has turned into a pissing match. I wasn’t aware so many seem to be going off a daily star article of all things. Lol christ. I am going off French media reports including local press from the Haute-Garonne. There is far more information there about the evidence against him, his sustained criminality and his own quotes about falling in with the wrong crowd and the impact that this has had on his life. This is not from journalists taking a ten minute break from writing about Hannah’s tits to write about someone he hadn’t heard of ten minutes ago.

Of course from a legal perspective the bar should be high. Aurier should not be punished without due process. And his killer(s) should be prosecuted with the full weight of the law. Part of the human tragedy that is being reported in the French press is about the difficulty of extracting oneself from criminal behavior. It’s actually a tragedy for society that it is far easier to fall into this world than it is to extract oneself from it. This is sociology and an interesting thing to think about.

It’s possible to hold multiple thoughts simultaneously that exist in tension. It doesn’t detract from the immense suffering this killing has caused. <3
 

Oscar22

Well-Known Member
Apr 9, 2004
16,819
15,351
Shall we just agree to disagree gents.

Sad story, agree with those who say he should be given the rest of the season off.
 

Japhet

Well-Known Member
Aug 30, 2010
19,232
57,392
1. It's incredibly disrespectful. Especially at a time like this to suddenly bring about unsubstantiated allegations to detract from a loss of life.

2. The idea that "oh well they broke the law" (again allegedly) so that we can act blase about someone's passing is disheartening to the core. It's a tragedy either way. The idea that unlawfulness makes your life worth less in the eyes of some is incredibly sad.


I don't think criminality makes a life worth less (necessarily) but it often makes it a lot more precarious.
 

LeParisien

Wrong about everything
Mar 5, 2018
3,212
8,169
I don't think criminality makes a life worth less (necessarily) but it often makes it a lot more precarious.
That is the point. Aurier had an out - the great saving grace of sport. And presumably some financial security through his brother. And he made bad decisions (BY HIS OWN ADMISSION) which put him in contact with the kind of unsavory characters who cruelly took his life. Given that he had access to imitation firearms and tear gas canisters and frequented high crime areas, it is most plausible he knew he was engaging with dangerous people. It was an inherent and calculated risk of the lifestyle he chose to lead.

That is a completely separate issue from moral desert. No one deserves to be shot dead. NOONE.

What a shitty situation.
 

Mark_147

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2011
1,807
3,019
Wow. I regret posting because this has turned into a pissing match. I wasn’t aware so many seem to be going off a daily star article of all things. Lol christ. I am going off French media reports including local press from the Haute-Garonne. There is far more information there about the evidence against him, his sustained criminality and his own quotes about falling in with the wrong crowd and the impact that this has had on his life. This is not from journalists taking a ten minute break from writing about Hannah’s tits to write about someone he hadn’t heard of ten minutes ago.

Of course from a legal perspective the bar should be high. Aurier should not be punished without due process. And his killer(s) should be prosecuted with the full weight of the law. Part of the human tragedy that is being reported in the French press is about the difficulty of extracting oneself from criminal behavior. It’s actually a tragedy for society that it is far easier to fall into this world than it is to extract oneself from it. This is sociology and an interesting thing to think about.

It’s possible to hold multiple thoughts simultaneously that exist in tension. It doesn’t detract from the immense suffering this killing has caused. <3
Was he charged and found guilty of any criminality with regards to this incident? If the answer is no then he's innocent simple as.
 

LeParisien

Wrong about everything
Mar 5, 2018
3,212
8,169
Was he charged and found guilty of any criminality with regards to this incident? If the answer is no then he's innocent simple as.
I haven’t seen any follow up after reports that he was arrested after an investigation and summoned to appear before a judge. So I don’t know how it turned out. But I am not saying he was legally guilty of anything.

The police found his DNA on a hat and tear gas canister left at the scene of an assault. The police commented he was previously known to them for delinquent behaviour. Aurier himself admitted falling in with the wrong crowd for many years and that it negatively impacted his life.

This is not a LEGAL question. The bar there should be high because his liberty might be deprived. This is about a clear pattern of behaviour that puts himself in precarious situations. It takes some mental contortion to deny that if you read French media reports (and not just a trashy British tabloid).
 

Mark_147

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2011
1,807
3,019
That is the point. Aurier had an out - the great saving grace of sport. And presumably some financial security through his brother. And he made bad decisions (BY HIS OWN ADMISSION) which put him in contact with the kind of unsavory characters who cruelly took his life. Given that he had access to imitation firearms and tear gas canisters and frequented high crime areas, it is most plausible he knew he was engaging with dangerous people. It was an inherent and calculated risk of the lifestyle he chose to lead.

That is a completely separate issue from moral desert. No one deserves to be shot dead. NOONE.

What a shitty situation.
Can you please give me a link to what you state that he had access to firearms and tear gas.
 

SargeantMeatCurtains

Your least favourite poster
Jan 5, 2013
11,764
61,758
What the fuck am I reading? A man has died and there’s a dickhead speculating about the events leading to his death? Nobody should lose someone that young, whatever the circumstances.

Show some fucking respect.
 

LeParisien

Wrong about everything
Mar 5, 2018
3,212
8,169

Mark_147

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2011
1,807
3,019
I haven’t seen any follow up after reports that he was arrested after an investigation and summoned to appear before a judge. So I don’t know how it turned out. But I am not saying he was legally guilty of anything.

The police found his DNA on a hat and tear gas canister left at the scene of an assault. The police commented he was previously known to them for delinquent behaviour. Aurier himself admitted falling in with the wrong crowd for many years and that it negatively impacted his life.

This is not a LEGAL question. The bar there should be high because his liberty might be deprived. This is about a clear pattern of behaviour that puts himself in precarious situations. It takes some mental contortion to deny that if you read French media reports (and not just a trashy British tabloid).
Unless he was found guilty of a crime then he's innocent Irrespective of DNA found at a prostitutes flat. It's all alledged and makes no sense which is why I suspect he wasn't charged with a crime. You go to a prostitutes flat and tear gas her and leave your hat and the tear gas cannister behind. I wonder how many men visit that establishment on a daily basis and touch things in her flat. What are the odds it was her tear gas to deal with unruly punters.
 
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