Harry Winks - Leicester City

[Primativ]

Have to say I thought he struggled out there tonight a bit. Not to be too harsh on such a good team performance, but both him and Walker Peters looked very out of their depth first half.

Winks gradually settled down but considering he's supposed to be the passer in CM for us, he gave the ball away badly on about 3 occasions which really could have cost us.

Second half he was much better but for sure he was the weakest player we had out there, still think it's the clearest position we need to upgrade. He still isn't showing enough incisive / ambitious passing range.

 

[Chimbo!]

Does anybody remember the days of Michael Brown in midfield? That’s when you can justifiably moan.

Winks is young, makes mistakes but is pretty fucking good on the ball. He can go past people without much pace and open space; that makes him very useful to us. And let’s no forget, he’s very young.

And for those complaining about him occasionally giving the ball away, this is a reminder that we were playing at the Nou Camp. There is no harder match in football than that.

For what it’s worth, I thought Winks played very well tonight.

 

[bc205]

Have to say I thought he struggled out there tonight a bit. Not to be too harsh on such a good team performance, but both him and Walker Peters looked very out of their depth first half.

Winks gradually settled down but considering he's supposed to be the passer in CM for us, he gave the ball away badly on about 3 occasions which really could have cost us.

Second half he was much better but for sure he was the weakest player we had out there, still think it's the clearest position we need to upgrade. He still isn't showing enough incisive / ambitious passing range.

Thought he played very well myself, after a slightly shakey start.

He had by far the best midfielder passing stats of the game, with 71 passes at a 92% completion rate. Better rate than any of the Barcelona midfielders.

Of course that doesn't tell the whole story, and it would have been nice to see a few more expansive passes. But have you ever thought that he is this conservative because Poch tells him to play that way? It's how all of our deep lying midfielders play at the moment, so seems logical that it's on Poch's instructions.

There were a couple of loose passes that could have been punished. But you ignored the fact that he atoned on 2 of them by winning the ball back with excellent tackles.

Wasn't his best game for us, but did very well considering he was up against Rakitic, Artur and Busquets. Certainly did not look out of his depth and was not our weakest player.

 

[Primativ]

Does anybody remember the days of Michael Brown in midfield? That’s when you can justifiably moan.

Winks is young, makes mistakes but is pretty fucking good on the ball. He can go past people without much pace and open space; that makes him very useful to us. And let’s no forget, he’s very young.

And for those complaining about him occasionally giving the ball away, this is a reminder that we were playing at the Nou Camp. There is no harder match in football than that.

For what it’s worth, I thought Winks played very well tonight.

The passes he gave away he was under zero pressure, it's carelessness / lack of concentration.

Thought he played very well myself, after a slightly shakey start.

He had by far the best midfielder passing stats of the game, with 71 passes at a 92% completion rate. Better rate than any of the Barcelona midfielders.

Of course that doesn't tell the whole story, and it would have been nice to see a few more expansive passes. But have you ever thought that he is this conservative because Poch tells him to play that way? It's how all of our deep lying midfielders play at the moment, so seems logical that it's on Poch's instructions.

There were a couple of loose passes that could have been punished. But you ignored the fact that he atoned on 2 of them by winning the ball back with excellent tackles.

Wasn't his best game for us, but did very well considering he was up against Rakitic, Artur and Busquets. Certainly did not look out of his depth and was not our weakest player.

If he wasn't our weakest player out there? Who was?! Obviously not including KWP. I thought every time he tried an expansive pass he gave the ball away so he kept it very simple and sideways. Struggle to think Poch instructs him not to be able to find a full back with a diagonal pass, or make incisive passes forward when the pass is on. Still plays too within himself and is not demonstrating the passing I thought he had.

At the moment he is a young less tenacious Scott Parker, that's not a criticism its just facts. That is exactly how he plays.

 

[smallsnc]

The announcers on the US broadcast praised him for his play in many instances and overall. Yes he made a few bad passes but he also handled a couple of very tough balls played to him in traffic that would have let to a break without an excellent first touch and pass. Winks does the one thing that our other midfielders don't always do, he provides an easy option for others to pass to by getting in position to receive the ball in space. It's that little bit of extra movement that I think many overlook. I am not sure who the weakest regular was out there tonight but if it was Winks on that performance then we will win more often than not.

 

[TheHoddleWaddle]

The passes he gave away he was under zero pressure, it's carelessness / lack of concentration.



If he wasn't our weakest player out there? Who was?! Obviously not including KWP. I thought every time he tried an expansive pass he gave the ball away so he kept it very simple and sideways. Struggle to think Poch instructs him not to be able to find a full back with a diagonal pass, or make incisive passes forward when the pass is on. Still plays too within himself and is not demonstrating the passing I thought he had.

At the moment he is a young less tenacious Scott Parker, that's not a criticism its just facts. That is exactly how he plays.

He isn't the finished article. He played against who are debatably the best side there is. Albeit they rested a few. All things considered he was fine. The whole team suffered a little rabbit in headlights at The start, affording Barca way too much respect, but soon settled as did Harry. Winks needs to step up a grear to be considered as a top player, But he is definitely on the right trajectory.

In terms of perspective, you cannot ping the ball about like pirlo against Barca as all you'll do is give them possession. Both winks and kwp kept it simple and it worked.

This game, as it was for KWP and no doubt many others was a massive learning curve. Mostly about self belief imo.

 

[Shadydan]

Imagine not rating a player because of a couple of dodgy passes in the Nou Camp, Jesus Christ.

 

[stevenqoz]

The passes he gave away he was under zero pressure, it's carelessness / lack of concentration.



If he wasn't our weakest player out there? Who was?! Obviously not including KWP. I thought every time he tried an expansive pass he gave the ball away so he kept it very simple and sideways. Struggle to think Poch instructs him not to be able to find a full back with a diagonal pass, or make incisive passes forward when the pass is on. Still plays too within himself and is not demonstrating the passing I thought he had.

At the moment he is a young less tenacious Scott Parker, that's not a criticism its just facts. That is exactly how he plays.

Barcelona....Camp Nou....Busquets...Coutinho....Rakitic ....Arthur ....83 minutes....holding the midfield....Dier not playing a minute....91% pass completion

 

[bc205]

The passes he gave away he was under zero pressure, it's carelessness / lack of concentration.



If he wasn't our weakest player out there? Who was?! Obviously not including KWP. I thought every time he tried an expansive pass he gave the ball away so he kept it very simple and sideways. Struggle to think Poch instructs him not to be able to find a full back with a diagonal pass, or make incisive passes forward when the pass is on. Still plays too within himself and is not demonstrating the passing I thought he had.

At the moment he is a young less tenacious Scott Parker, that's not a criticism its just facts. That is exactly how he plays.

Scott Parker - why do so many people feel the need to make comparisons the whole time? Such a pointless exercise.

He clearly had a better game than Sonny and Dele (not that they were bad, just not that good).

Winks has been passing the ball like this since he broke into the side, our other central midfielders pass the ball like this as well. Do you really think a manager as controlling as Poch is would allow this if he didn't want them to play that way?

He's also still developing as a player, and learning how to play in massive games like last night. Hardly surprising that he wasn't trying to play lots of Hollywood passes, especially as that clearly wasn't his job last night.

He's not perfect, but he's a hell of a good prospect, who has been a key part of our best ever start to a Premiership season.

 

[truebluespur]

We have a very gifted midfielder on our hands with Winks. Very fortunate to have someone like him coming out of our youth system, massive Spurs fan, bags of ability, seems to have a high ceiling as well, and comes across as an intelligent young man too.

 

[@Bobby__Lucky]

It's not always about shining, but allowing others to shine with what you do. Winksy held the midfield together with discipline and simplicity.

 

[luRRka]

Barcelona....Camp Nou....Busquets...Coutinho....Rakitic ....Arthur ....83 minutes....holding the midfield....Dier not playing a minute....91% pass completion

Putting it into perspective even more - coutinho 87%, rakitic 76%, Arthur 91%, messi 90%, busquets 84%, Denis Suarez 67%

 

[theShiznit]

He's obviously learnt from Dembele, as he gave the ball away a couple of times last night then immediately won it back (Dembele usually gets 5 minutes of his name sung after that )

Sure there were a few bad passes, but I'm not gonna criticize as they were attempts at more progressive passes, and even after misplacing a couple he still tried, and on other nights they will come off. And every other aspect of his game worked well last night.

 

[Kilkenny Cat]

Big fan but thought his distribution was awful last night, and he didn't help KWP by selling him short with one early pass. Maybe it's more a case that Winks needs a sitter like Dembele alongside him - as opposed to a non-sitter like Sissoko - in order to do what he does best?

 

[DJS]

I fucking love Winks.

I love the fact he’ll get better each season, the fact he’s one of our own and the fact he respects my squad number OCD and is wearing the number 8 shirt ???

He’s a different kind of player to what Dembele was but that is just fine and he provides a different kind of quality.

Now just waiting for Skipps to come through and make it a spurs twosome in midfield (or Binks ).

 

[Primativ]

Imagine not rating a player because of a couple of dodgy passes in the Nou Camp, Jesus Christ.

Imagine not being able to judge a players performance objectively. Jesus Christ.

 

[Primativ]

Scott Parker - why do so many people feel the need to make comparisons the whole time? Such a pointless exercise.

He clearly had a better game than Sonny and Dele (not that they were bad, just not that good).

Winks has been passing the ball like this since he broke into the side, our other central midfielders pass the ball like this as well. Do you really think a manager as controlling as Poch is would allow this if he didn't want them to play that way?

He's also still developing as a player, and learning how to play in massive games like last night. Hardly surprising that he wasn't trying to play lots of Hollywood passes, especially as that clearly wasn't his job last night.

He's not perfect, but he's a hell of a good prospect, who has been a key part of our best ever start to a Premiership season.

No he didn't. Alli and Son were superb. Son didn't have his shooting boots on for sure, but Son was easily one of our most dangerous players and Alli's ability to find pockets of space and turn and pass through balls and linking the play was a joy to watch. Sorry, but I'm not having that, Winks was definitely the weakest on the pitch last night.

His play style is so similar to Parker at the moment, sideways, safe passes, 360 degree pirroutes in the centre cirle, drives forward with the ball occasionally with a burst of pace to beat some players, actually the similarities are uncanny at the moment.

Not sure why people get so defensive about others judging a players performances honestly. No need for caveats.

 

[Shadydan]

Imagine not being able to judge a players performance objectively. Jesus Christ.

I really wonder if you know what that term means

 

[allatsea]

No he didn't. Alli and Son were superb. Son didn't have his shooting boots on for sure, but Son was easily one of our most dangerous players and Alli's ability to find pockets of space and turn and pass through balls and linking the play was a joy to watch. Sorry, but I'm not having that, Winks was definitely the weakest on the pitch last night.

His play style is so similar to Parker at the moment, sideways, safe passes, 360 degree pirroutes in the centre cirle, drives forward with the ball occasionally with a burst of pace to beat some players, actually the similarities are uncanny at the moment.

Not sure why people get so defensive about others judging a players performances honestly. No need for caveats.

He is playing to order and thus limiting his forward movement. Comparisons to Parker whilst he his playing this way (under Poch’s orders) is fair.

 

[bc205]

No he didn't. Alli and Son were superb. Son didn't have his shooting boots on for sure, but Son was easily one of our most dangerous players and Alli's ability to find pockets of space and turn and pass through balls and linking the play was a joy to watch. Sorry, but I'm not having that, Winks was definitely the weakest on the pitch last night.

His play style is so similar to Parker at the moment, sideways, safe passes, 360 degree pirroutes in the centre cirle, drives forward with the ball occasionally with a burst of pace to beat some players, actually the similarities are uncanny at the moment.

Not sure why people get so defensive about others judging a players performances honestly. No need for caveats.

Not defensive, just fundamentally disagreeing with your analysis.

You clearly don't particularly rate Winks. That's fine. But a lot of us do, hence why we are disagreeing with you.

The stats obviously don't support your argument either. Now they don't tell the whole story, but they show how consistent and reliable his passing actually was last night. They are definitely not the stats of the weakest player in the team.

Dele and Sonny were fine last night, not saying they were bad. But neither of them had a great game. Sonny especially was very wasteful, which has to be counted when evaluating his performance, given that scoring goals is his main job.

No one here is saying Winks was amazing last night. They are saying a young, inexperienced player performed well in a massive game against a Barcelona midfield full of international stars. The stats, and the ratings he has received from the majority of fans and pundits, support that view.

You have set an unrealistically high bar for him to reach each game, and then criticise him when he misses it. I don't think that's objective personally, or very fair.

He's not the finished article yet, and has struggled with bad injuries. Have a bit of patience. We should be supporting him as he develops, not looking for reasons to criticise him.